No, I can assue that no other trucks were sent. They might be in the station ready to go, but they don't leave.

I agree, that the search would have been very difficult. Who knows, they may never have found them even with help. It doesn't excuse a lack of effort though.

I'm glad you can see their station from your office.

I didn't read where the 911 operator passed that information (someone screaming) along.

While Adam and Jenn were not, a lot of drinking, hollering, and junior behavior goes on at the beach.



Could have been a lot of things. We know different, now.

I can.

But they did search. They searched the most logical places based on the ranger's past experience. Had they been in the ORV section, they would have been found lickity split. They weren't there. It was dark.

I must be wrong, but I didn't think it was that uncommon to cancel a search until conditions changed (such as becoming light) if the initial search didn't find anything.

OK, we'll try this one more time.
This has no bearing on their duty to act. They have a responsibility. So did the Sheriff's department that cancelled themselved off of the call. I'm sure they'll be mentioned in the lawsuit also. Just because it could be something else doesn't relieve you of you duties. Plain and simple.

And when the search in the logical places didn't turn anything up another call should have been placed to OnStar to check the status of the vehicle and the search should have been expanded.

I give up, I'm going to bed. BTW, all the guys here at the staion wish there were more people out there like you who wouldn't hold us accountable so we could get more sleep at work.

Are you reading the posts? About 3" above your comment was this:According to the coordinates givin, the water.Moving down the line I can't help but admire the response of marcmedic. He is willing to take responsibility for actions he does, or does not takeI would start looking where the mayday coordinates dictated.Again, here are the coordinates: 38.21 latitude and -75.14 longitude. The coordinates are outside the designated offroad area so why was only the legal Offroad Area searched? The motion of the waves geanerally moves objects north anyway. Any ambiguity as to where the vehicle was should lead an experienced Ranger to check north.Wrong, they did not search the area of the coordinates provided by OnStar.

It seems that a few new members are jumping in here without reading the entire thread. Furthermore, they are not reading all the info available to them in this thread.

Most here are not castigating the Rangers or the Troopers. If you newbies would read EVERYTHING before posting you would see most of us are merely curious as to the truth.The GPS coordinates makes this response sound elementary. Actually, it's sad.Good question. Let's see. An CYA out there?Wrong again. We are merely trying to find out the truth as to what happened by sharing information. As for this incident, let's see. OnStar button pressed, hysterical woman, coordinates in the water. Humm, you aren't that bright are you, hummoron? If nothing else, a man's machismo should demand finding that woman. I guess we know where you stand. If I knew a woman was in danger I'd do anything I could to find here. Even following coordinates.

Of course, I must reiterate, I am not blaming the Rangers. Generally, they do a wonderful job. I just want to know what happened. Plain and simple.

No, they did not. The coordinates offered to them is where the search should have started.

Now if I am wrong, then I will have no problem apologizing to all involved.

Again, I just want to know what happened with the rescue effort and what caused the roll.

Didn't they have the vehicle's number? Could they have called it to follow up on the vehicle themselves?

Marcmedic, forget it. Hummoron is not interested in a logical answer. He just felt really bad for being an insensitive moron earlier on. Now he needs to feel better about himself. Therefore, he will continue to argue to the death the syntax of his opinions, since they are the excuse for his earlier assholic posts.

All I can say is if I ever do something stupid and needed serious help, I hope to God I reach emergency personnels with your attitude, and not Hummoron's.

Thanks for doing a good and noble job!

Ditto H2F.

Clearly, some of you don't quite understand the way a search works. When a call comes in, an Incident Commander is assigned. It is usually the highest-ranking officer available. He has a scribe, whose job it is to record, on paper, all actions and communications involved in the search as well as the time these occur. He also has assistants assigned to him and he chooses a site commander (the person in charge "on scene", who dispatches everyone there.

The first step is called the bastard search. All of the expected places are checked. This includes bathrooms, restaurants, coves that people frequent. Simultaneously, the assistants are gathering information: cell phone numbers, OnStar numbers, home & work numbers, local accommodation numbers. All of these are called. As much information as possible regarding clothing, ID, provisions and experience of the lost people is gathered and collated. After all this is done, if the person has not absolutely, positively been confirmed as found, what do you think happens?

Well, what is supposed to happen is a full-blown multi-agency search with all available resources begins. Why? Because the standard is that the search continues until those lost are rescued or recovered.

What actually did happen? Somebody said, “Aw shucks, it's a big area to search, it’s late, they're probably gone by now anyway.” No verification of whether or not that was the case. This violates the most basic principles of the search and is the DIRECTLY ATTRIBUABLE cause of these people not being found until they had expired. This sort of assumption is LETHAL and a total F.U. to lost public taxpayers.

When I hear the lame excuses asking "Why didn't someone say longitude and latitude coordinates instead of just coordinates" or "well maybe the ranger didn't have GPS" or how far from the coordinates were they found?" it makes me want to scream. Any ignoramus ranger knows what coordinates are. They all have GPS, and if they don't or don't know how to use them, THEY NEED TO ESCALATE THE SEARCH TO A HIGHER AUTHORITY! When you ask, "What's the Sheriff going to do? Roll a squad car on the sand?" Respectfully, that's none of your damned business!" You have no idea what airships the Sheriff has at his disposal or what interagency agreements exist. NONE OF THIS JUSTIFIES CALLING OFF THE SEARCH. A search NEVER gets called off because someone thinks they're probably okay or gone. This MUST BE VERIFIED and was not. When I hear you say, "They looked in the most likely places" I want to say yes, and they didn't find them. This is like ‘looking for a coin you lost 4 blocks away because the light is better over here.’

Bottom line, this isn’t a question of poor judgment and is not open to conjecture. The wheel doesn’t get invented from scratch when a missing persons call comes in and people don’t sit around and guess what they think happened and they don’t vote on what to do. There are strict protocols to follow and they were not followed. It is entirely possible that, because of this, two young people are dead. NO MORE B.S., NO MORE EXCUSES!

KenP, I was asking my question in direct response to the post above. I hadn't heard anyone mention the hummers having a black box before, hence my "?!" and the end of sentence. I was surprised. Obviously I don't know all the wonderful details about your chosen vehicle. I was further admitting that it could be a great tool to clear up what actually took place.

Okay, since the moderator is apparently going to close my account, this is probably close to if not my last post on the subject, but have enjoyed my brief stay here, and mostly see intelligent posts on the accident, even though obviously differring views, and appreciate the mostly civil nature of the replies here. That said, I will try and shed a little more light before being booted.

During the striper run at AI, it is usually only fishermen out on the beach at night, and as said, many of us are out there 2-3 days at a time. From personal experience it seems at night there is usually two or three rangers on duty during the night (probably more scheduled come June when the tourists and school kids arrive, but that is when most of us fishermen find other spots until mid September).

Generally, before dark, most of us find our night time fishing spot and for the majority stay until it gets light out, so patrolling the beach is a fairly easy deal.

Now, as stated before, and know little about GPS, andnot knowing the need of the OnStar operator to give seconds in the co-ordinates, which apparently were not given, and using mapquest, best I could do, seems the co-ordinates give locations from just west of Berlin, MD into the ocean.

Another thing I thought of is "where actually was the vehicle found"? Might have been in the State portion of the Park, and maybe the rangers did check the National Park area, finding nothing, if just driving up and down near the water's edge, might take an hour and a half or so.

Like I said, does not appear all facts have been release about this event, so we are only coming up with scenerios as to the hows, whats and whys.

Anyhow, thanks for letting me share, though to many, my opposing thoughts, and in closing, drive responsible and smartly, because whether Hummers or Jeeps, we are all off roaders, so same family, just different personalities.

Be safe, no need to make people think all offroaders are jerks or idiots, which for the record, as a majority, we are not, we are responsible and appreciate and take care of what areas to have fun on are open to us.

Just in case my account is closed though, goodbye. If not, if I hear of any more relavent facts, I will let ya'll know.

Have Jeep will travel.

Quote by Shaggy:Just in case my account is closed though, goodbye. If not, if I hear of any more relavent facts, I will let ya'll know. UnQuote:

This is the Hummer Forum! You can't get kicked off here! Don't pay any attention to Alec; he's still confused and thinks your the other Shaggy! Don't leave! We need intelligent people to add to the discussion (even if they drive poo-poo Jeeps ) You have to say a lot worse than Linda did to get booted. Maybe Stripersonline should think twice about why they did that because it's obvious some of you were interested in the investigation. That's okay, we'll take you and we're glad to have you here.

Gee, and I just figured the real reason he wanted me gone was that I drive an '87 Jeep Wrangler, and not my name, cause this is a Hummer board, but thanks H2 Rocks, me just wanting to find the facts, and give what info I can about AI and the rangers.

Can't respond about Linda's post, since it was deleted before I read it, but will say stripersonline is just a bunch of fishermen with four wheel drives that, well hang out and fish. Just seems many times things happen, and the consequences are less than appealing to us. Maybe part of our fear is, enough happens there, we lose our priveledges to fish all night, may be selfish, but that is our escape, and night time is the right time for fishing, just not the time for learning the beach. Also, I believe after dark, people on the beach must be actively fishing, not real sure there, might just be a reference to the fact that no sleeping on the beach after dark, but dozing off during sunlight hours while tanning is permissible.

Have Jeep will travel

Shaggy, don't leave, just change your screen name. Our Shaggy has worked hard and taken loads of **** and has earned recognition as our lovable coat hanger-looking, mop-headed, mooching, deluded hippie with a lingering question about his true sexuality.

Do you want to be associated with that rep?

Just change your name. We need another Jeeper to tease and make our wheeling beer bitch.

Well, except for the last part,about true sexuality, you have described me to a T. Me, don't believe in changing screen names from site to site, because, I is what I is, and if someone reads my posts anywhere, well, I would prefer it be as shaggy, small S.

Now, if I have to, before the moderator closes me, maybe he can change my screen name here to Jeepster or something so all know I am the "black sheep" of the Hummer family, and give me a nice little picture (preferably a Jeep, because it is a Jeep thing), but can't in good conscious, do it myself, and don't know how to make the little ol' pictures.

But, believe it or not, want to get along and play by the rules, so maybe throw some suggestions, and we can have ya'll vote on the final choice.

Have Jeep will travel

Oh yeah, Hummers or not, you guys and gals are okay in my book

Shag,

Just change you screen name or open a new account as shaggy jeep (shabby jeep? shabby cheap? the other shaggy? the smarter shaggy? you get the idea) or something like that. We'll knkow who you are. Drop the concern about being blocked. If we have tolerated Hummoron for this long, we're certainly not going to cut you.

As far as not having seconds reported on the coordinates, that is another specious arguement. The coordinates given peg the location about 1/4 mile off shore. At that point, you call the boats and choppers out. You do not decide that this very specific location "might be far enough off to be somewhere on shore, so let's not initiate the ICS. No one even TRIED using the coordinates to get a location that night. This is just more after the fact BS in an attempt to cover behinds.

Okay, with the advice of legal council, and the desire to some, name changed. As the Rolling Stones once sang "please allow me to introduce myself"

shaggy is now beachinJeeper, and wishes all a Happy Holiday (and don't mean to offend those of differring beliefs).

Still would like to get more facts out into the open and to the public, and maybe one day they will.

Still looking to see if I can find out if vehicle was in the Federal or State portion of the Island, could answer some questions, maybe not many, but

Have Jeep will travel

Who are you and why are you here?

Somone asked about the recovery of the"black box" (dont know if thats really what it is called or not on a Hummer)... but I have found out that they did. It shows the time of the accident the speed at the time of the accident (15 mph) and that the airbags WHERE employed. That is all the further info that I was told. Just thought I would pass that on to those that were asking.

Have a wonderful Easter.
-Linda

Linda,

Just curious. Do you know if the vehicle was recovered in the State Park area of the Island or the National Park area?

If he was only going 15mph, and have no reason to doubt this as factual, then they hit an oceanside sand cliff (which have seen 3' and larger), which probably was seen too late, and maybe an attempt at overcorrecting, or not seen at all.

Again my condolences to all the family and friends of these two young people.

The deignated beer bitch, and the other ex-shaggy (make mine a Bud Light)


Have Jeep will travel

Ok, great. You can go now.

Okay, don't know the factuality, if that is a word, but get my drift, or the accuracy, but here is a post from another site, and unfamiliar with OnStar, well those that are may be able to shed light....

"When a vehicle equipped with Onstar receives a "hit" hard enough to deploy the airbags,the Onstar system in the vehicle automatically sends an emergency message to Onstar and the operators call to ask if the occupants are ok. That is the origination of the 911 call in the beach fatalities on Assateague. The vehicle was upside down according to the report. It is my belief that the antenna for Onstar is located in the roof of the vehicles. Upside down in salt water it is not very effective. The prohibited area on Assateague might be there because there is unexploded ordinance in that area. Those "mapping" programs aren't accurate once off the roads.FYI"

Like said, I don't know anything about this aspect, so chime in and straighten me out.

Have Jeep will travel

adams hummer did have a blackbox. i dont know if im aloud to tell details because of the investigation and stuff. but i will tell you guys that his black box proved to us that he was going slow. just thought you guys might want to know.

BJ, lay off the ganja, buddy.

1. Electromagnetic radiation doesn’t give 2 ****s about what you believe is effective! Upside down and immersed in saltwater, OnStar got the coordinates and reported them to the authorities.

2. Those mapping programs ARE DESIGNED to zero in on locations without the use of landmarks (roads). FYI!

3. Self evident. Pretty well covers your 1 & 2.

Peace, t~

The blackbox did not say he was going 15 mph, however, that was very close. My uncle was saying just the other day that that information may not help us because he could have hydroplaned his hummer, which could have made the blackbox say he was going slow. Just thought you might want to know.

Ok, you can let this thread go away now.

This will be my first and last reply.

I feel compelled to post because I am the probably the most experienced of anyone with Assateague Island and Hummers. I own both an '99 H1 & '03 H2, I have actively, frequently fish AI (Assateague Island) for the last 6 years using the H1 as my "beach buggy". I use the H2 when I have an overflow of guests. Both Hummers are AI Park permitted.

I have traveled the entire island in all types of weather conditions including snow. I have been trapped by high tides from the Nor'easters that blow here. I have swerved around the items that wash up including a whale! I have carefully found my way over the sand cliffs and high tide washes that frequently form. I have driven into holes left unfilled from kids trying to dig to China. I have traveled that desolate dark island in sleepless stupors and in influenced states.

I have stood the H1 on its nose, jammed feet of wet sand in through the windows, buried it to its running boards. I have also put the h2 on very similar precarious angles both intentionally and accidently. Want to see the repair bills?

The death of 2 young people on that Island is a sobering event and very unfortunate for the families and emergency services related to the incident. I have learned something.

After reading 8 pages of posts, my thoughts are to those who 4-wheel and to those who rescue. I can assure everyone that the accident was due to carelessness and recklessness, plain and simple. No different than a drunk driver who runs off the road. As heartless as it sounds, I believe that if you are going to attempt extreme adventures, then there are rules to follow... If you don't. You play, you pay.

I hope that everyone here on this board learns, thinks and is reinforced about the obvious, that 4-wheeling is inherently dangerous. Don't ever rely on rescue services to save you! Only rely on your common sense, please! There are too many reasons, for me to list here of what I speculate to have happened. As an Hummer and AI expert, I can plainly see the sequence of events that occured and why. However, whatever specifically happened, my sympathy stops short with my condolences.

I come away with this story (and I hope that others do too) that we should never hold the park service people to be held responsible, never hold them into some type of culpability or liability for the lose of those lives in that situation. I am very said for the loss of 2 young people just having "fun", however I am encouraged to use this as an example and lesson to my 10 & 11 yr. old boys, in hopes that they maintain common sense at all times.

Never ever drive or ride unprepared for the worse, in dark or desolate or unfamiliar or illegal areas with out the buddy system, unless you have a death wish.

All well and good for you, but it still doesn't absolve the rangers of negligence.

I guess you must love paying taxes to support a service that you don't count on to do their jobs.

I guess you must love paying taxes to support a service that you don't count on to do their jobs. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bingo! I couldn't agree more with Marc's posts on this subject.

Makes you feel pretty darned appreciated, doesn't it Marc and Tower.

I guess no one should be held responsible for doing their jobs, especially those that are paid with our tax money.

Paragon,

For Marc and myself, thank you. It really get's my back up when people make excuses for irresponsible emergency personnel. There are so many of us working hard to do our jobs responsibly. I feel like that’s lumping us all into one category and it makes me feel slimy. Ours is a business where not doing you job can cost lives. But not telling the truth will continue to cost even more.

Sorry for the rant. Thank you, again.

After reading this thread and the last couple of posts I must respond to Tower and Marcmedic.
I see you throwing around words like negligence and incompintence, too lazy to do their job. From your posts Tower,Iam going to assume...something I fear you may have done a lot of,you were 3,000+ miles away from this tragic accident, Marcmedic I do not know where you were. As for me I was asleep in a warm bed. I did not have the information or lack of information that the rangers had. I was not out there planning, searching, or trying to find these people. So how can I evaluate the performance of these people...I can not and I will not. At least not from an internet site where anyone can post and portray to be whomever they choose. Not from the popular media either whose main drive is to sell papers. I too have been involved in EMS and Search and Rescue as a volunteer and proffesional for over 25 years. I have worked an incident, read the report in the paper and not even realized it was the same accident. Be the rescue proffesional you claim to be. If you have hard facts bring them out lets discuss it. It does not help anyone to arm chair quaterback an incident without the true facts. By the way if the media or internet ever starts blaming you, don't worry I've got your back. At least until there is some hard evidence to the contrary and there is documented action taken against you.

Keep those tips up