Hummer Forums by Elcova

Hummer Forums by Elcova (http://www.elcovaforums.com/forums/index.php)
-   General Off Topic (http://www.elcovaforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=11)
-   -   Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!? (http://www.elcovaforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23817)

bparker 01-14-2007 06:13 AM

Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
WTF is wrong with our government? Do they think we are so stupid to believe that our govt needs the ability to track credit records of suspected terrorist in the middle east?

Terrorist do not go into a bank and ask for a loan to buy a bomb...

Am I missing something here or is this just gay?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washing...-records_x.htm

Quote:

WASHINGTON (AP) ? The Pentagon and to a lesser extent the CIA have been using a little-known power to look at the banking and credit records of hundreds of Americans and others suspected of terrorism or espionage within the United States, officials said Saturday.
Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman said Saturday the Defense Department "makes requests for information under authorities of the National Security Letter statutes ... but does not use the specific term National Security Letter in its investigatory practice."
Whitman did not indicate the number of requests that have been made in recent years, but said authorities operate under the Right to Financial Privacy Act, the Fair Credit Reporting Act and the National Security Act.
"These statutory tools may provide key leads for counterintelligence and counterterrorism investigations," Whitman said. "Because these are requests for information rather than court orders, a DOD request under the NSL statutes cannot be compelled absent court involvement."
"It is our understanding that the intelligence community agencies make such requests on a limited basis," said Carl Kropf, a spokesman for the Office of the National Intelligence Director, which oversees all 16 spy agencies in the government.
The national security letters permit the executive branch to seek records about people in terror and spy investigations without a judge's approval or grand jury subpoena.
The Federal Bureau of Investigation, the lead agency on domestic counterterrorism and espionage, has issued thousands of national security letters since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.
Whitman said Defense Department "counterintelligence investigators routinely coordinate ... with the FBI."
The national security letters have prompted criticism and court challenges from civil liberties advocates who claim they invade the privacy of Americans' lives, even though banks and other financial institutions typically turn over the financial records voluntarily.
The New York Times reported on expanded use of the technique by the Pentagon and CIA in an article posted Saturday on the Internet.
The vast majority of national security letters are issued by the FBI, but in very rare circumstances they have been used by the CIA before and after 9/11, said a U.S. intelligence official who spoke to the Associated Press on condition of anonymity because of the issue's sensitivity.
The CIA has used these non-compulsory letters in espionage investigations and other circumstances, the official said.
"It is very uncommon for the agency to be issuing these letters," the official said. "The agency has the authority to do so, and it is absolutely lawful."
Another government official, also speaking on condition of anonymity, said one example of a case in which the letters were used was the 1994 case of CIA officer Aldrich Ames, who eventually was found to have been selling secrets to the Soviet Union.
None of the officials reached by the AP commented about the extent of use by the Defense Department agencies, but the Times said military intelligence officers have sent the letters in up to 500 investigations.
Associated Press Writer Katherine Shrader contributed to this report.
Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

dеiтайожни 01-14-2007 06:23 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Terrorist do not go into a bank and ask for a loan to buy a bomb...


Hmm... you sure seem to know a lot about how and how not to buy these types of things. Anything you need to tell us?

NJ H2 01-14-2007 03:17 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Personally I thinnk the Government should track suspected Terrorists anyway they can. Why do you care if they track suspected Terrorists anyway? :confused:

bparker 01-14-2007 03:41 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
I will defer if you can give me one example of why a terrorist would use "credit" for his dirty dealings....

Think....

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJ H2
Personally I thinnk the Government should track suspected Terrorists anyway they can. Why do you care if they track suspected Terrorists anyway? :confused:


deserth3 01-14-2007 04:59 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
To keep track of expenses for tax purposes...

Wouldn't want him to go to jail for tax fraud before he had a chance to blow himself up would we?:twak:

bparker 01-14-2007 06:52 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
ROFL again... how many terroist do you think are here in the USA using credit to buy things?

Amazing...

deserth3 01-14-2007 07:47 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
I definetely don't know. But try to buy a plane ticket or rent a car without one. More and more they are required.

NJ H2 01-14-2007 08:04 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by deserth3
I definetely don't know. But try to buy a plane ticket or rent a car without one. More and more they are required.


Exactly :beerchug:

I really don't this any Terrorists are rolling up to the American Airlines Ticket Counter with Cash :giggling:

Vettster 01-14-2007 08:13 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
I mean it's like a suicide bomber is gonna worry about his credit rating after he blows himself up.:p

bparker 01-14-2007 09:10 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Actually alot of people use cash abroad. Its mostly americans who use credit cards. And not to mention if you dont think they already get a list of people who board planes or are inbound to the USA via the airlines logbook you are mistaken.

I still cant think of a reason they need to look at our credit...
Quote:

Originally Posted by NJ H2
Exactly :beerchug:

I really don't this any Terrorists are rolling up to the American Airlines Ticket Counter with Cash :giggling:


DennisAJC 01-14-2007 09:17 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NJ H2
Exactly :beerchug:

I really don't this any Terrorists are rolling up to the American Airlines Ticket Counter with Cash :giggling:


X3. If they think they have a good cover, they'll use a credit card at every opportunity (They're not worried about paying for a bill they'll probably never see.). Cash nowadays brings up the red flag depending on the amount. I've travelled quite a bit and I find most cultures nowadays use Credit instead of cash.

KenP 01-14-2007 09:49 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
I don't care if they track CC payments. Hell, I'll give them mine if they ask nicely.

bparker 01-14-2007 11:24 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Its not CC payments..

Its really not that big of a deal - to me - most are missing the point.. oh well...

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenP
I don't care if they track CC payments. Hell, I'll give them mine if they ask nicely.


SnakeH2 01-14-2007 11:28 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Its not CC payments..

Its really not that big of a deal - to me - most are missing the point.. oh well...


Was there a point?

KenP 01-15-2007 12:35 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
They can track the purchases of airline tickets. I don't want a suspected terrorist on my plane, do you?

bparker 01-15-2007 01:29 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
omg of crouse....

we are soooooo off track at this point...

DennisAJC 01-15-2007 01:47 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
omg of crouse....

we are soooooo off track at this point...


Maybe you should be more clear next time.:rolleyes:

I want to make vulgar and negative comments towards you but my upgrades do not allow it.

I think you're the tops!:beerchug:

bparker 01-15-2007 05:19 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
lol you can always use PMs :D

deserth3 01-15-2007 11:58 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
omg of crouse....

we are soooooo off track at this point...


What thread here doesn't go off track? It's part of the reason I like it here.:clapping:

I get your point. But I can also look around at our society and see how clueless and volnerable we actualy are. Despite 9/11 there are still alot of people out there who think that nothing like that would happen to them.

h2co-pilot 01-15-2007 01:54 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Doy!

They track credit cards because they are given to them by a "sponsor" group or individual. Most of them are pre-paid, like children off to college.

Individuals and contract holders add cell members to an account and those purchases can track locations etc. I bet the hijackers used credit cards to but their plane tickets- and in that case the plane was a WMD. So their tactics are unconventional and therefore purchases may be.

It's not so much the purchases but the activity.

Quote:

"It is our understanding that the intelligence community agencies make such requests on a limited basis,"

And the big broad random searches don't yield much anyway.

Data mining is not an invasion of privacy because it is programmed and run by super computers. If you think that every purchase you make isn't compiled into reports already you are sadly mistaken.

Am I pissed that my "Food Lion MVP Coupon Card" on my keychain tracks what I buy? No. Hopefully, the store will carry more of the Tampax pearl variety.

NEOCON1 01-15-2007 01:58 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
we need to hunt them down with any means we have . all this pu$$y footin around is gonna get us killed ;)

h2co-pilot 01-16-2007 04:25 AM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
OH BPARKER!!!:D I responded on topic and have been waiting.:yawn:

http://www.elcovaforums.com/forums/s...1&postcount=20

Where are you? Oh wait hold on.....
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
..
.
.
.
.
..
.... I see you have been at 7-11 and bought a bag of Doritos. Man, your breath must stink!!

After you brush your teeth with the COLGATE you got last week, come back and we can discuss.:fdance:

bparker 01-16-2007 02:07 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Co-pilot - i see you missed it too. This is not about credit cards. Who cares about credit cards...

I can see that this threads intention was missed by so many and now its diluted to $hit slinging again by internet wanna be badasses

The intended topic was about CREDIT HISTORY - not CREDIT CARDS. Which in my view is a bit comical because really W T F do you think "government" can gain by accessing our "credit history" in regards to terrorism or espionage - which was their justification for doing so.

Again, I repeat for those that don?t get it. It is FUNNY for those that see the light. I guess if it still doesn?t strike accord with you then we have different views about what our govt does that may be funny to you or me..

At this point who cares as now everyone is sitting with baited breath just to take a stab at me for some fuked up reason.

h2co-pilot 01-16-2007 02:29 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Co-pilot - i see you missed it too. This is not about credit cards. Who cares about credit cards...

I can see that this threads intention was missed by so many and now its diluted to $hit slinging again by internet wanna be badasses

The intended topic was about CREDIT HISTORY - not CREDIT CARDS. Which in my view is a bit comical because really W T F do you think "government" can gain by accessing our "credit history" in regards to terrorism or espionage - which was their justification for doing so.

Again, I repeat for those that don’t get it. It is FUNNY for those that see the light. I guess if it still doesn’t strike accord with you then we have different views about what our govt does that may be funny to you or me..

At this point who cares as now everyone is sitting with baited breath just to take a stab at me for some fuked up reason.


You're did the Dean scream during that post didn't you.;):D

I care, but I read this and thought banking and credit records. I saw nothing indicating a score.

Quote:

The Pentagon and to a lesser extent the CIA have been using a little-known power to look at the banking and credit records of hundreds of Americans and others suspected of terrorism or espionage within the United States, officials said Saturday.

Not to mention the New York Times beautifully leaking our methods to our enemies- again.

It's obvious we have had different opinions. But honestly I was making light of your responses (in my last post) in this thread, not being a badass. :confused:

I and others (probably) thought they were contributing and you have been so demanding. Like a kid yelling at you for not knowing that Thor has the horns and He-man doesn't. Calm down. Jeez.

bparker 01-16-2007 03:27 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Yea differences of opinions are great as it brings possible information and other views not considered by others into view for a better perspective.



First you said....
Quote:

.... I see you have been at 7-11 and bought a bag of Doritos. Man, your breath must stink!!

After you brush your teeth with the COLGATE you got last week, come back and we can discuss.

Now you say...
Quote:

But honestly I was making light of your responses (in my last post) in this thread, not being a badass.

SnakeH2 01-16-2007 03:48 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Yea differences of opinions are great as it brings possible information and other views not considered by others into view for a better perspective.


Unless those opinions are sh*t. Then it's just a waste of energy;)

bparker 01-16-2007 03:53 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Lol well you know what they say about opinions - they are just like aholes and everyone has one. Some just smell better than others.. :beerchug:

h2co-pilot 01-16-2007 04:14 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Yea differences of opinions are great as it brings possible information and other views not considered by others into view for a better perspective.



First you said....

Quote:

.... I see you have been at 7-11 and bought a bag of Doritos. Man, your breath must stink!!

After you brush your teeth with the COLGATE you got last week, come back and we can discuss.


Now you say...
Quote:

But honestly I was making light of your responses (in my last post) in this thread, not being a badass.





My orginal post was on the first page.

I thought that the Doritos thing was funny, I was kidding, if it offended you for some reason then I can't help you. Sorry. To me, it was far from being a badass. Maybe I should have used smilies- but then again, I thought it was obvious that it was not malicous.

LOL, did you have a bad experience with Doritos when you were younger or something? Maybe you didn't chew one enough and one of the little corners scraped your throat? :D:D(That's a little badass, again. Please don't let this upset you.)

And you are totally off topic from this thread as you were bitching about earlier.

What is your opinion then? Tell me why you have a problem with the procedure in the article.

NewHummerGuy 01-16-2007 04:34 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
I dont care one bit what the government does as far as these types of things go.

If you have nothing to hide then who gives a shlt. Look at my credit records, bank statements, and whatever else. As long as they dont resort to anal cavity searches at the airport I could really care less. If it in any way increases americans safety then by all means do whatever you want.

IMO those who bitch and complain about these types of things are the ones who should be investigated.

Hmmmmmm, maybe the ACLU should be investigated.

DennisAJC 01-16-2007 04:36 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
I think our friend bparker is just being paranoid. There are no badasses here! And if there were any, they have been chased off or forced through a radical attitude ajustment procedural upgrade.

And no bparker! It's not brainwashing by our government! LOL! I love everyone!




The Doritos comment was funny and obviously a joke. Nobody here is picking on you bparker so do not feel alone and cornered. We are here to support you.:)

bparker 01-16-2007 04:50 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
lol you are probably right about those who complain about it. I just cant find the link between the need to see them and terrorism. I am all for doing whaterver it takes within reason but I would like to at least understand "why" "Govt" needs to overstep certian laws to achieve thier goal.

in this case its so trivial its funny to me

I would think the saying "cant see the forest for the trees" applies to many here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewHummerGuy
I dont care one bit what the government does as far as these types of things go.

If you have nothing to hide then who gives a shlt. Look at my credit records, bank statements, and whatever else. As long as they dont resort to anal cavity searches at the airport I could really care less. If it in any way increases americans safety then by all means do whatever you want.

IMO those who bitch and complain about these types of things are the ones who should be investigated.

Hmmmmmm, maybe the ACLU should be investigated.


DennisAJC 01-16-2007 04:57 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
OMG!!!! bparker!!!! LOL!!!! LOL!!!! LOL!!!!

Are you a Jehovah Witness??? So persistent. So bent on making others see your way. Just banging away at them doors! It's cute! Like my 3 year old banging away at his drums in defiance when I tell him it's bedtime!

You go my friend!:perfect10s:

bparker 01-16-2007 04:58 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Dennis, i entirely appreciate your cheeky political position here but the truth here is "its all fun and game until someone gets hurt" and in my time on this forum when the jokes start is always someone with a ({}) that gets hurt. And then all the powers that can be mustered come down on said joker to show him he has no right to joke with a ({}) that way and he usually ends up banned.

DennisAJC 01-16-2007 05:01 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
My older version supported your ideals bparker, so I'm very sympathetic to your pleas.

But since my upgrade, I've seen the light! There is no conspiracy.


Just friends, good-times and noodle salad.

bparker 01-16-2007 05:03 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Nope, that style of religion is not my cup of tea. If you find me simply replying to a poster in sake of conversation applicable to the thread topic unlike yours to be "So persistent. So bent on making others see your way. Just banging away at them doors! It's cute! Like my 3 year old banging away at his drums in defiance when I tell him it's bedtime!" - well thats your opinion.

Have a nice day =D

Quote:

Originally Posted by DennisAJC
OMG!!!! bparker!!!! LOL!!!! LOL!!!! LOL!!!!

Are you a Jehovah Witness??? So persistent. So bent on making others see your way. Just banging away at them doors! It's cute! Like my 3 year old banging away at his drums in defiance when I tell him it's bedtime!



SnakeH2 01-16-2007 05:08 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DennisAJC
My older version supported your ideals bparker, so I'm very sympathetic to your pleas.

But since my upgrade, I've seen the light! There is no conspiracy.


Just friends, good-times and noodle salad.


Upgrade 6.0????:rolleyes:


I sense imposter. Sure you're not someone's AE?? If that's possible...:D

h2co-pilot 01-16-2007 05:29 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
ATTN ATTN:

bparker is enlightened and we all are morons. He sees the forest for the trees. Please do not post your opinion as he will LOL at you.

That is all.

bparker 01-16-2007 05:35 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Ahh now I get it, my appologies =)

Now I understand how forums work - "if I enter a thread and cant post something relative or usefull, I might as well attack someone"

dеiтайожни 01-16-2007 05:41 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Do they think we are so stupid to believe that our govt needs the ability to track credit records of suspected terrorist in the middle east?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
I still cant think of a reason they need to look at our credit...



Are you implying that we are all suspected terrorists in the middle east? If you don't want them looking through your credit records, don't be a suspected terrorist from the middle east. Nuff said!

h2co-pilot 01-16-2007 05:48 PM

Re: Terrorists dont use credit to buy WMD!?!?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bparker
Ahh now I get it, my appologies =)

Now I understand how forums work - "if I enter a thread and cant post something relative or usefull, I might as well attack someone"


That's exactly what you did.

Did you read my first post or the thread? I gave an explanation on why "hundreds" are being data mined and my opinion that it is effective and relatively harmless to Americans. You kept on asking "why they are doing it. I don't understand. WTF? You missed the point." to almost every post made.

You have been so determined to "lol" and point out that the point was missed. However you have yet to tell us what exactly you think the point is.

It seems

A.)you didn't interpret the article correctly or

B.)you have an explanation on why exactly you think it is wrong and what the true point is (so to speak) and you are just heckling until you come out with your opinion on why it is wrong.

Very confusing and pointless so far.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:59 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.0.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.