[CLAYDOG]

Originally Posted by 03H3

My original point about departure angle wasn't unique to Moab. Hummers are built with the "angles" in mind. So are the other vehicles that the other manufacturers actually intend to be capable off road. So far every Hummer has class leading "angles" look at other trucks in the same class, small/midsize pick-up not midsize SUVs. The angles are important off road, climbing is climbing. That's why they consider those angles in the first place. You can't consider all 4X4's "off roaders". If the vehicle overhangs in the front and the rear, and has **** clearance at breakover, then all 4 wheels aint going up that.

I can't tell whats underneath that camouflage anymore than anyone else. With the exception of F5 and Claydog, we are all just speculating.

It does look to me (Bebe's post #4, first picture) like the rear bumper has been moved further back, that might just be subterfuge. If it isn't, or if I'm seeing it wrong, it won't hurt the dpt angle as much as it looks like it will, to me.

GM's engineers know what Hummer is, it's not them I worry about. I think that GM should remain loyal to the original idea.

I like the new JK, but I don't like Jeep Liberty's. They sell a lot of them though.

The spare is not the first point of contact when checking departure angles.