looking at buying an older H1

[quadrunner]

i was wondering if there are any problems i shoul consider with buying an early 90's H1 , any corosion problems or anything like that? thanks

[EXH1X5]

Originally Posted by quadrunner

i was wondering if there are any problems i shoul consider with buying an early 90's H1 , any corosion problems or anything like that? thanks

Why do you want "an early 90's" ? ...in other words; What will be the PRIMARY usage for such a HUMMER???

[Gadget]

Depends on what you want to do with it and how well you like to work on your own rig.
97.5 and 98's are the best years to go after due to the many upgrades that were done over the earlier 90's. 99 and up have ABS and TT4 traction control which many offroader don't like.
I have a sweet 98 soft top for sale and can be contacted at awolhmv@aol.com

[quadrunner]

im looking at the older ones strictly from a cost stand point, there are a couple in the area for around 30,000 . i probably wouldnt be doing any hard off roading with it but ill be using it for pulling my atvs , i've just always wanted an H1

[partsguy]

H1's are indeed a beast but,do you know what is needed to maintain this creature? Unless you are fully aware of what you are getting into do not buy untill till you have done your home work.

It seems that every time a H1 needs service it requires anywhere from $500.00 to 2k in parts and god knows in labor.


Great truck but need TLC ALL THE TIME.

[EXH1X5]

Originally Posted by quadrunner

im looking at the older ones strictly from a cost stand point, there are a couple in the area for around 30,000 . i probably wouldnt be doing any hard off roading with it but ill be using it for pulling my atvs , i've just always wanted an H1

When it comes to HUMMERs, it's NEVER a good idea to look for older ones purely from a lower initial purchase price standpoint. There are just too many variables between model years/models/options/accessories/upgrades/etc. The rule-of-thumb that seems to apply to out-of-warranty AMG HUMMERs is;

First year of ownership = Purchase price + $10,000 (maintenance, etc., etc.)
Second year of ownership = First year costs + $5,000. (additional maint. , accessories, etc.)

BTW quadrunner; ALL AMG HUMMERs built prior to 1Q 2000 were simply called HUMMERs. After that point GM got in the ‘HUMMER business’ and needed to 'rename' AMG's HUMMER the "H1" in order to line up their own "family of Hummers” behind it.

[The Green Lantern]

[Beastmaster]

Originally Posted by partsguy

H1's are indeed a beast but,do you know what is needed to maintain this creature? Unless you are fully aware of what you are getting into do not buy untill till you have done your home work.

It seems that every time a H1 needs service it requires anywhere from $500.00 to 2k in parts and god knows in labor.


Great truck but need TLC ALL THE TIME.

And how did you come up with that figure for parts?

For me -
A Service: 60 bucks
B Service: About the same
C Service: Gee, unless I need to replace an Idler, Pitman, or Ball Joint, about 80 bucks. If I had to replace one of those parts, it goes up to about 200-250.

And most of the time, the A and B service is done at a local car wash place that has Diesel engine oil change specials that uses Shell Rotella 15w40, which is the specified oil for the 6.5L TD.

Other parts that "might" break or wear items that need replacing:
Halfshaft repair - $120 for lifetime warranty replacement/repair of a halfshaft (Phoenix Rack and Axle - they do the US Border Patrol halfshaft rebuilds)
Brake Pads - 65 bucks an axle (Right/Left)
Brake Caliper, Front - $12.99 at most Checker/Schucks/Kragens
Rotors - $60 bucks at your local GM parts counter, NAPA, or Autozone
Power Steering Pump - Generic GM Metric Power Steering Cartridge - 50 bucks
Ball Joints - Upper or Lower averages about 50 bucks at NAPA
Air Filter - 45 bucks.
Fuel Filter - 20 bucks
Transmission Filter for a 4L80E TF329 - 20 bucks
Thermostats - 30 bucks (x2 since most H1's have dual 'stats)

Labor - even if you do pay a shop to do it, call it 70 bucks an hour. Most of these items that need replacing that I've mentioned above don't take more than 2 hours book time to do the work. And - since I've done the work before replacing ALL of the stuff mentioned above, I know that if *I* take less than 2 hours to do this stuff, a competent mechanic will take *LESS* time to do it than what I did it in.

To boot, almost all of the stuff mentioned doesn't even require you to take off the undercarriage protection.

Even a new long block 6.5 TD is only $2700. Three guys can swap one out in 24 man hours total if you have all the tools and hoists. At 70 bucks an hour, that is $1680. So even if you had to replace an engine, it will be roughly 5K if you look at replacing every fluid and hose component.

So - I don't mean to be too contrary, but it's not as bad as you make it out to be. If you know how to cross reference the parts, the costs of maintaining an H1 is VERY reasonable. And if you look at the stuff like engine parts (standard GM 6.2L NA/6.5L NA/6.5L TD), it's easy to find replacement items at most local parts suppliers.


-Steve

[EXH1X5]

Originally Posted by Beastmaster

[snip] So - I don't mean to be too contrary, but it's not as bad as you make it out to be. If you know how to cross reference the parts, the costs of maintaining an H1 is VERY reasonable. And if you look at the stuff like engine parts (standard GM 6.2L NA/6.5L NA/6.5L TD), it's easy to find replacement items at most local parts suppliers.-Steve

Me neither ...BUT ...Steve, YOUR cost examples for an old HUMMER (dubbed the H1 by GM) ?on-the-cheap? could be mis-leading to the average green-as-grass buyer. The rule-of-thumb that seems to fit MOST old & out out of warranty, AMG HUMMERs is;

First year of ownership = Purchase price + $10,000 (maintenance, upgrading, personalizing, etc., etc.)
Second year of ownership = First year costs + $5,000. (additional maint. , accessories, etc.)

[Beastmaster]

Originally Posted by EXH1X5

Me neither ...BUT ...Steve, YOUR cost examples for an old HUMMER (dubbed the H1 by GM) ?on-the-cheap? could be mis-leading to the average green-as-grass buyer. The rule-of-thumb that seems to fit MOST old & out out of warranty, AMG HUMMERs is;

First year of ownership = Purchase price + $10,000 (maintenance, upgrading, personalizing, etc., etc.)
Second year of ownership = First year costs + $5,000. (additional maint. , accessories, etc.)

And I don't necessarily agree with that statement. I'll agree with the principle you're mentioning, but not the costs. And doing it how you call it "on the cheap" isn't the issue - it's using common sense.

I'll take mine as an example. It was barely maintained within the minimum specifications and I did have to do some work with it for the first year that I owned it.

I've had my truck for 4 years. Since then, I've had 15 services (45000 miles / 3000 miles per service interval). Average cost per service - 60 bucks. That's 900 dollars.

Parts that I had to replace in the past 4 years. Includes labor for those times I contracted stuff out:
New A/C Compressor and components - 300 (includes R134A and the A/C tools)
New Stereo - 300
CTIS lines - 400
Idler/Pitman - 400
Batteries - 300
Tires - 1200
Ball Joints - 300
Halfshafts broken (4) - 320
Belt - 40
Thermostats - 60
New Radiator Hose - free (broke while on a Dealer Hummer Happening)
Vacuum Pump - 100
Head Gasket - 150 (Rush shipping costs added in)
2 Piece Rim gaskets - 50
Injector Pump - 1000 (I contracted this one out)
PMD/FSD's (excluding spares) - 500
Power Steering Cartridges - 150
Total so far for parts: $5570 across 4 years for parts and labor.

Accessories/Upgrades added:
New Upgraded Military Luverne Brushguard - 600
New Rear Locker - 800 (including spare diff to rebuild while not taking the truck down)
Spare Tire Carrier and Fuel Can Carrier - 800
HID Headlamps - 200
Predator Steering Stabilizer/Used - free
New LED Warning strobes and used Siren - 300
Used MileMarker Winch and Milemarker Bumper - 400
PIAA lighting - 200
Hella Area lighting (including back up lights) - 100
Jump Seat - 100
Predator Test Pipe/Used - 100
Slantback shell - 400
M101A2 Trailer - 400 (heck, it's an accessory!)
Thule Rack parts - 200
Back Up Camera - 100
Military light kits - 100
Paint - 200 (includes paint/primer/sanding stuff for various stuff)
Total for accessories over 4 years - $5000

Spare Parts bought over 4 years that *aren't* being used right now:
3 Complete Halfshaft Kits - 600 bucks
2 PMD/FSD's with heat sinks - 300
Pitman/Idler combination - 250
Spare Ball Joints - Upper/Lower sets (2) - 160
CTIS Pump - 100
CTIS Manifold with spare solenoids - 50
Spare 2.73 diff - 200
Spare Transfer Case - 700
Spare 2.73 Ring/Pinion - free, was the original that came with the truck
Spare Torsen 1 Diff - free, was the original that came with the truck and removed to put the locker in.
Spare Doghouse - $50
Spare water pump - 60
Spare radiator box/fan shroud - $80
Spare shocks (6) - 400
Spare tie rods and rod ends (3) - $300
Spare injector pumps (3) - 800
Total spare parts - $3750

So - over 4 years (including spare parts that most people wouldn't necessarily carry/keep), I'm at a total of $14320. Parts/Labor/Upgrades alone is only $10570 - across 4 years....

Now, admittedly there is a huge cost savings for doing the majority of the work yourself or during wrenching parties.

I do admit that the secret for my cost savings is - I know what I want, I know what I'm willing to pay for it, and I shop around. And - unless my truck is "down", if I don't need it immediately - I can wait to get it until I find it at the price range I'm willing to pay. In other words - no impulse buying.

As for the parts - Common sense says that since the vehicle (for most of it's drivetrain) uses commonly available parts, there's no reason for paying pricing above what the general market (not the Hummer market) will bear.

- Steve

[EXH1X5]

Originally Posted by Beastmaster

[snip] So - over 4 years (including spare parts that most people wouldn't necessarily carry/keep), I'm at a total of $14320. Parts/Labor/Upgrades alone is only $10570 - across 4 years....

- Steve
__________________
1997.5 HMC4 Hummer H1 w/Slantback shell (Mine)

So what did Susan say ...or better yet, what did she do when she found out about that "little matter of $14,320"


What your example/personal experience does NOT take into consideration is the fact you started out with a 5 model year old 1997.5. So now factor in all the costs to bring, say a 9-12 model year old ...1997 ...or a 1996 ...or a 1995 ...or even a 1994 just up to the level you STARTED at ...like $5,000 for a HVAC upgrade, etc., etc.!

[Beastmaster]

Originally Posted by EXH1X5

So what did Susan say ...or better yet, what did she do when she found out about that "little matter of $14,320"


What your example/personal experience does NOT take into consideration is the fact you started out with a 5 model year old 1997.5. So now factor in all the costs to bring, say a 9-12 model year old ...1997 ...or a 1996 ...or a 1995 ...or even a 1994 just up to the level you STARTED at ...like $5,000 for a HVAC upgrade, etc., etc.!

Hehe..she's aware of it. Some of the mods, she's actually condoned or recommended, so she's fully aware of what's gone into the truck. Stuff like the Jump Seat, or the knee mod that I inherited when I bought a spare doghouse, the roof rack, and the slantback shell were all "approved" as a good idea for mods.

Now that my truck is pretty much settled in, hers is getting ready for the makeover, once everything arrives.

I will agree that each truck is individual - you won't know until you actually end up with it. However, even trucks like a 1994 have their own place and sometimes can even have and advantage - like all mechanical IP's (yay!).

And then you have some owners who don't want to do any mods at all - they leave it stock, and just handle the parts/labor side.

Definitely, I think we both agree that getting a truck that was maintained on schedule and consistently makes a huge difference in the first year's cost of ownership.

[hmcoleap]

I am whole-heartedly with Steve on this one... those numbers are out of whack unless you are a guy who just drives to the dealership for every rattle and quirk.

I bought a 95 that was out of warranty, and I have never spent anywhere near those kinds of amounts. I find that my Land Rover is actually more expensive to maintain than the Hummer is, because the parts are not common GM or otherwise available as "non-genuine" parts.

Like Steve, most of my "Hummer money" has been spent on spare parts, modifications and upgrades - not routine maintenance.

Originally Posted by EXH1X5

Me neither ...BUT ...Steve, YOUR cost examples for an old HUMMER (dubbed the H1 by GM) ?on-the-cheap? could be mis-leading to the average green-as-grass buyer. The rule-of-thumb that seems to fit MOST old & out out of warranty, AMG HUMMERs is;

First year of ownership = Purchase price + $10,000 (maintenance, upgrading, personalizing, etc., etc.)
Second year of ownership = First year costs + $5,000. (additional maint. , accessories, etc.)

[EXH1X5]

Originally Posted by hmcoleap

I am whole-heartedly with Steve on this one... those numbers are out of whack unless you are a guy who just drives to the dealership for every rattle and quirk.

I bought a 95 that was out of warranty, and I have never spent anywhere near those kinds of amounts. I find that my Land Rover is actually more expensive to maintain than the Hummer is, because the parts are not common GM or otherwise available as "non-genuine" parts.

Like Steve, most of my "Hummer money" has been spent on spare parts, modifications and upgrades - not routine maintenance.

S and M you two guys are definitely "exceptions" to that rule-of-thumb! Now let's consider the extreme opposite end of the cost scale from yours. Did you happen to notice the third person to post to this very thread??? Do you also recall that person stating a while back he had over $50,000.00 worth of repairs done to his '98 HMCO to get it to where he wanted it? His $50K figure no more represents the norm, than you two guy's "on-the-cheap" figures do. I will stick by the figures I previously stated!

[leenigen]

I bought a '94 that was in desperate need of maintenance. I think the previous owner bought it and drove it for 10 years without doing a single thing to it. I've had it for two years now and have constently been repairing/maintaining what should have been maintained over the years. I've had to replace all the steering components, most suspention, most ctis, all fluids, and misc. engine parts. The point is that even with an older truck that needed tons of work I was able to get it to a reliable daily driver condition for appx. $2k. Admittadly I did nearly all the work myself and was able to wait until I found parts I was willing to pay for. I refuse to pay the "hummer" mark-up for parts I can get at a normal automotive market price. The cheapest trip to the dealer was $380 and that was only because a ctis line blew on the road in front of the dealer. Dealer mark-up is definitly not worth it. Learn to do it yourself or you'll never afford it.
Also, I have not upgraded anything beyond buying "upgraded" quality parts that needed replaced. Add-ons can wait until the truck is in good shape - which is about now. The upgrades/add-ons will quickly surpass the $2k.

[galifardo]

Hello wath should be the maintanance that i have to do to a H1 1998, i will buy it next week and i dont know wath to check or to expect in cost, could you tell me where can i find a table to know when to do the expected changes.....