EATON FRONT E-LOCKER

[Hummie2]

FRONT E-LOCKERS

Hey Steve R I checked this out just for you buddy. I though I would start a new topic on it as I did't want the news to get burried at the end of the old thread.

Front Eaton E-Lockers are in the works for the GM 9.2IFS!

I just got off the phone with the folks @ Reider Racing www.reiderracing.com and the tech guy told me the E-lockers are coming but are running about 6 months behind schedule. He said hopefully will be available in 2-3 months. Price should be the same as for rear E-Locker which is priced at $695.95

ARB air lockers are presently available for front for $695 and require a air compressor for$190. He said the H2's compressor might work but ARB unit requires 130psi pressure min. Would have to check and see if H2 compressor can
make that much pressure.

I have coil rear suspension so therefore no air compressor. I think I will wait for E-Locker.

I usually don't give endorsements but Reider Racing and Rancho Suspension are 2 companies that I have been satisfied with. Reider were the people who modified that Detroit Locker I mentioned in the other thread and it was truly a thing of beauty when they finished with it.

Don

[JJ]

Hummie2 - man, you have the best photos of the H2 assy. After following several of Mike's and Steve's earlier posts I became more coherent on IFS and SFA, etc..
But what I'm still confused on is this Independent 4-wheel drive thing. Do you think the questions I've been getting referred to Independent Suspension versus solid axles?

JJ

[JJ]

I had a feeling the questions I was getting earlier were in reference to Independent Suspension (like the H1 - right). I'd never heard of Independent 4-wheel drive.

JJ

[Mike97ZJ]

Thanks for the kind words, Hummie. You sound very experienced and knowledgeable yourself.

And kudos to you if you install that E-Locker yourself. Looks like a complicated job. I'd be leary of installing one in a sold axle, never mind an IFS diff.

The swaybar disconnect sounds like a good idea. I think it will help out in hte rear, but not sure what the difference will be in the front. I have a friend who wheels a '99 GMC 1500, and he removed his front swaybar and didn't notice much of a difference while offroad. The rear of that truck articulates surprisingly well though.

It's kind of the opposite on my Jeep. Disco'ing the front bar makes a world of difference (I actually have a set of JKS Quick Disconnect links) while removing the rear bar doesn't make that much difference at all. I've removed my rear bar, and haven't noticed much of a diff. Actually, I'm going to put it back on whem the weather gets warmer. The bar actually keeps it a little more stable in offcamber situations.

I'm sure you could rig something up. I saw a great idea on one board. A guy took a quick disconnect air coupler and welded the male side to the lower link, and the female side to the swaybar. So you disconnect the swaybar the same way you'd disconnect your impact wrench from an air hose. Ingenious, I think. I'll post a pic if I can find it.

[TonkaH2]

Yikes, my truck is being built as we speak, and I'm suddenly rethinking the air spring assembly/ride height sensor concept. It does look easy to break, and there have been a few failures. . . hmmm. What a revolting development.

-Jack
Yellow H2 adv. on order [forever]
Alaska to ??? June '03
www.sunspotnatural.com

[Gray]

what is the elocker i have heard about it but im not sure exactly what it is or what it does

Gray

[Steve R]

Thanks for the informative words guys. Agreed, the front-locker is the sweet ticket and I'm in the shop the day it comes out.

I watched as another H2 attempted to go over some rocks and did not really use the brakes. The inexperienced driver just applied gas until the rig lurched up and over the rock....only to come down hard with a nasty crushing noise under the belly. Right there and then I realized I'd be using my brakes along with throttle to regulate my progress.

I don't mean to brag....but heck...I went over and through that rock-garden with gentle fineese....not once crashing down. We took our time, chose our lines and worked it out. The other H2 looked like a hippo grinding itself for pleasure on a pile of rocks: it was brutal and ugly!

So often I see drivers and spotters having total disregard to technique. It's a shame.

As for me, I couldn't even see the rocks below me...I was literally flying blind and being guided by my spotters. I was the driver/controls-technician....they were the pathfinders and guides. It was very cool!!! Gotta do it again and get some pics...my buddy Scott told me he saw the H2 doing all sorts of amazing things to get through there...very impressive.

[Mike97ZJ]

Buddy,

Yeah, I don't want to get into that debate. Everyone has thier own opinions about it, and sometimes its like talking to a brick wall. It's very hard to change someone's opinion.

IFS is good enough for most situations. Add a front locker, and your all set.

Don, those are some great pics you have. I see what you mean about all that air suspension junk in the way. Not much room up there for the swaybar. Good call on going with the coils, seem to me the air suspension is just another thing that will need fixing somewhere down the line. I tend to like things simpler and can do without electronic gadgets like that.

Keep us posted if you ever get around to designing some disconnect links or experiment with removing the rear bar.

I wonder if it would be possible to engineer disconnects that will allow the whole bar to be removed? Maybe get some QD's for the links themselves, and then get some wing nuts or something similar for the bolts that attch the bar to the axle. I'm thinking something like those wing nut valve cover bolts they make. The ones shaped like a "T" that you don't need a wrench to remove.

Before I got my JKS QD's, my "quick disconnects" consisted of a 1/2" drive ratchet with a torx bit and a 18mm box end. Reason I bought the JKS units was that my stock links needed replacing, so at $40 each from the dealer, I might as well fork over the extra $40 and get the JKS.

[Mike97ZJ]

If I were doing it on my vehicle, I would want to be able to control the front and rear lockers independently.

It'd be nice to have the rear locked when you need it, but the front open so you can steer.

You'd have to be doing some extreme stuff to need a front locker.

[H2 TOIE]

and as soon as i posted that reply the pic came back

[Hummie2]

Heres one of the air compressor assy. and associated valving. I think the round object partly visible on the right to right of the compressor motor is a air drier/ filter assy., not sure though.

I was supprised at the size of the compressor. Larger than what I expected. Its rated a 11 amps. and 1/4 hp. motor.

[This message was edited by Hummie2 on January 26, 2003 at 12:04 PM.]

[Hummie2]

Picture of the rear air suspension bag. The bag is completely deflated here and not resting in its seat on top of the rear axle.

[Mike97ZJ]

Here's a few pics of my Jeep with the swaybar connected and disconnected. I figured I'd post them for the sake of....well just for the sake of me wanting to post pics, LOL.

This is my ZJ up on a rock with no rear swaybar and the front bar is connected.



This is my Grand on a different rock, but with the front swaybar DISconnected this time. It's different angle than the other pic, but you get the idea.



You can see that on my vehicle, it makes quite a bit of difference.

I know this doesn't really relate to what we're talking about, but hey, I felt like posting pics.

1997 Grand Cherokee TSi
It's got some lift, skids, and rock rails, among other things.

*member of the "No Hummer Krew"*

[Hummie2]

One last shot of the ride height sensor. It sits atop the upper control arm pretty close to the tire.

[Mike97ZJ]

Can you guys see the above pics? I could se them fine last night when I posted them, but now, on a different computer, they aren't showing up.

I suck at the internet.

[buddy]

Mike,

I've seen more and more of GM IFS getting switched over to SFA. I have a friend who has done a few conversions using Ford parts. He did his first about 5-6 years ago for a customer who uses it now as a show truck.

The debate over SFA and IFS is a no win deal.
You'll never convince hard core SFA guys, there's anything else, and I can see the point.
I've seen them do things in their trucks that I wouldn't do in my Chevy, or for that matter, couldn't do.

I think most of the hard core off-roaders would prefer SFA. I only do moderate off roading these days, so the IFS works for me. Heck, that's the only act GM's got.

Buddy

[Hummie2]

Mike...

Good point about the sway bar might get snagged. That was my first thought when I saw it for the very first time too. But then I thought about maybe the engineers left it down there for a reason, although they could have designed around the problem altogather. There are quite a few lines, wires, cables and a expensive air compressor & valving set-up above the sway bar. With the sway bar down like it is maybe someone will stop when the hear it draging on the rocks instead of continuing on and getting some more expensive parts snagged that are above it. Sometimes things are a trade-off when it comes to design and ease of production & costs usually win out.

Here are a few more pics of the rear and some of the more of the air compressor assy.& ride height sensors. It could be easy to damage in some cases, one of the reasons I decided to go with rear coil suspension, besides the coils were $1175 less cost and ride great.

[Mike97ZJ]

Do you mean will BTM make my open diffs act like limited slips? No, not really.

But I do drive with both feet, as it allows me to creep up a rock, and then get on the brakes and ease myself down slowly. Also, as I don't have that cool drive by wire throttle you guys do, it helps smooth out my throttle imputs. In low range, first gear, it can be a bit jumpy with a 2.72 low range, 3.73 gears, and 30" tires. So if I have some pressure on the brakes at the same time I'm on the gas, it allows me to drive a bit smoother.

That's my thing, I try to drive as smoothly and elegantly as possible. Not only is it much easier on the terrain and vehicle, I also get the satisfaction in knowing it was my driving, and not momentum, that got me over the obstacle.

You'd actually be surprised at how far I can get with open diffs. I have my flexy suspension to thank for that, it's good at keeping all four tires on the ground.

[Hummie2]

FRONT E-LOCKERS

Hey Steve R I checked this out just for you buddy. I though I would start a new topic on it as I did't want the news to get burried at the end of the old thread.

Front Eaton E-Lockers are in the works for the GM 9.2IFS!

I just got off the phone with the folks @ Reider Racing www.reiderracing.com and the tech guy told me the E-lockers are coming but are running about 6 months behind schedule. He said hopefully will be available in 2-3 months. Price should be the same as for rear E-Locker which is priced at $695.95

ARB air lockers are presently available for front for $695 and require a air compressor for$190. He said the H2's compressor might work but ARB unit requires 130psi pressure min. Would have to check and see if H2 compressor can
make that much pressure.

I have coil rear suspension so therefore no air compressor. I think I will wait for E-Locker.

I usually don't give endorsements but Reider Racing and Rancho Suspension are 2 companies that I have been satisfied with. Reider were the people who modified that Detroit Locker I mentioned in the other thread and it was truly a thing of beauty when they finished with it.

Don

[Hummie2]

[quote] "Just some additional thoughts. I've posted the similar inquiry on the H2ml and one person responded in reminding me that the traction control needs two things: 1) you must not be "on" the brakes at all (this foils the computers ability to sensor stuff) and 2) the rpm's/gas must be kept fairly level for a bit of time also for the computer to sense stuff."


Thanks for posting that Steve. That answers alot of questions. I was wondering why factory rep would recomend that you not use Brake/Throttle Modulation,BTM. True you do place more stress on drivetrain using BTM, but if done properly, not enough to hurt anything. Now I feel that their main concern is that the Trac Control is ineffective if you are on the brakes. I am in total agreement with you and Mike in that I will continue use BTM instead of bashing over the rock piles traction control or not.

I can attest that the Trac Control does work at speed. We found a fresh graded gravel road with nice sweeping "S" curves last weekend and decided to play alittle. You could hit the curves hard enough for the rig to break traction and start drifting sideways, let it slide to the apex of the curve and "Gently" apply a little more throttle and feel the Trac Control take over and "Pull" you back out of the corner ready to set up for the next curve. It was totaly awesome and far superior to just regular 4WD. The most fun I've had since I quit racing.

When the front locker becomes available I am definitely going to have one for crawling through the rough stuff using BTM and with H2s Trac Control for faster times we will have the Best of Both Worlds.

Don