High Performance MAF Sensor

[aj_111_78]

Has any one upgraded to this Granatelli High Performance MAF Sensor or something similar to it with an after market intake? Did you see any real inprovements? I am running a K&N intake and was thinking about getting this but I am Curious if its worth it.




http://www.mossh2.com/Shop/ViewProdu...eIndexID=54971

[dochummer]

I have the granatelli, the airaid filter and tube and Hypertech. I noticed a bit more pickup off the line. but nothing huge...

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

I had Granatelli on 99 Silverado with 5.3L and felt it of little help. So did not even look at one for H2. Even under boost of supercharger I see stock MAF doing fine up to 10lb. boost setup maybe a little less. I will need to look at maping tuner software above 5lbs. of boost and just eliminate the MAF completely since I have invested in tuning software anyway..

Plus since I'm moving to higher boost anyway I'm going back and store a tune for 5lb. boost as well since i can change boost level with change of a pulley. Then just flash the tune that goes with it.

Just an opinion but, do not feel it is worth the money when You could go to a tuning shop and just get a better tune for even the stock setup which will get the hidden HP and torque. Custom tuning is not just for boosted engines.
Go get all You can wth MAF money saved by getting a custom tune. You will be pleasantly surprised. Custom tune will get You more than what a handheld tuner will get. Having the handheld just allows You to go back and forth when You want to be completely stock.

When You get any tune make sure if you go into dealer that You either return the stock tune or make sure the dealer knows you have a custom tune. If You do not tell service dept. when they hook up to do any diagnosis their equipment will automaticly overwrite the custom tune. It recognizes that something is different than stock tune and want to get rid of it. Then replace it with something normal to machine the dealer uses.

TAZ

[obzidian]

i agree, for just about the same amount of money, you can get a pcm tuning software and get way more out of your stock lq9.

the granatelli is a good product but has been problematic during tunning.

TAZ, for sure you should go SD, also, im not sure if you have seen this, but a MafPro will allow you to, i believe, target a secific a/f ratio under WOT and adjusts your spark/fuel multipliers accordingly. Thus, giving you the opportunity to let say, increase your boost level, in cab, up to 20psi from 15psi and not have to worry about re-writing your pcm EVERYTIME!!

pretty trick huh? The big names in tunning, like the BS3 have this feature, all you have to do is implement the mafpro into your rig and your set.

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

I'll check that out obzidian.

The problem I see after having been thinking about solving the boost and tune changes is that the higher the boost goes the less accurate the modules look to potential be. I have visited with an owner of HPTUNERS and they are looking at this as well. If you are running on the edge of blowing up or not, a small amount of variance could be very harmful. I have talked to MSD Inc. about this also. I love there multiple spark controllers. What has happened to Accel anyway? It seems they have conceded the high tech stuff to MSD but, has continued to hold there own in the older muscle car needs. Sorry just came to mind as i was thinking about this.

I think You are correct in us looking that direction and it may do the job. The problem is different with supercharging versus turbo with an electronic controlled waste gate. You still even in that situation cannot have as sharp a tune as you would like because to many variables still exsist when really pushing the edge even with a turbo.

If you are trying to stretch a tune to cover to broad of a boost range they tell me the less accurate the tune is going to half to be or more liberal on one end of the spectrum than the other. None are sure yet how to get a round that from what I understand. On supercharger will someone design an adjustable SC pulley like grain harvesters use to change air volume that is blown through the crop to seperate crop from trash while it is on the go? That was the first thought I had since I farmed most of my life and was familiar with the cab controlled air speed that came along in late 70's and early 80's. Now no one even thinks about them being there since it is standard now. One side of pulley is rigged and the other is moved in and out with either an electric motor or by hydraulic force. Off the wall I guess as it would still have variables as the belts used wear out the width real quick from being squeezed in and out all the time. I had to stop thinking about it awhile because it hurt and I'm very familiar with the problems that system caused even in the newest machines on the farm still using the method. But, in that use it does not matter if air speed is of 100rpm or not. If the belts wear down it does not matter the pulley squeezes down till it gets the rpm you need on the gauge in the cab.

The main problem being in a SC is the pulley determines what boost is and each pulley can be 1/2lb. or so of boost different but, it does not matter as we tune to match the pulley and any amount of boost that we get on boost gauge. There are some problems I wonder if we are not going to get around when trying to be a tenth away from blowing a hole in a piston. I would think somebody will tweak it to be usuable in a general situation and it be safe.
But, I'm a little unsure about wanting to trust anything but the pulley I have the boost it gives and the tune to match. Then I want to keep close watch on the wear of the fan belt used. If tune is made with a new belt it needs to be maintained that way. So it still falls to degree of tolerance one can get for the use each has in store for the motor and ride.

I think the situation will end up being solved by having a gear box on the SC to be adjusted from driver seat so that You can have precise tunes to match a more precise boost adjustment. That may be a gear box on the front of the SC thus not changing pulley and then allowing for tune changing easier and more so trustworthy.

In my situation as others I'm going to tune as tight as i can based on a boost that I know I have with a certain pulley in hand. Then along with the fan belt age or wear. I'm guessing the problem is not going to be as temperamental when You are allowing alot of tolerance.

So I will sit back and watch what happens with advancement. I can change a pulley in a few minutes while waiting for computer to upload the tune and reflash with another tune. Maybe total time 10 minutes which would be at a track then change it back before heading out. I think Your suggestion would work real good in lower boost range in what would be the daily running around mode. I'm still out on this though till I see more numbers and especially what my sponsor HPTUNERS think as they look at it more.

Thanks for good info!!

TAZ

[tomp]

At the MossH2 price, I would do it for sure! It "will" help some. I like mine and paid the retail price for it

[CBR_Raven]

i noticed a little improvement with my Granatelli MAF sensor and Airaid intake but no huge power gains...just enough for you to notice better acceleration

[Screeper]

I run the gran. MAF and a factory match air raid filter and noticed a nice bump in performance. I also run the hypertech. I did not want the open intake with all the florida mud and rain so I kept the factory filter box.

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

Screeper I think You are smart staying with the factory box. It was designed to keep water out of intake. Anyone that off roads much I feel would be protecting their engine by using the factory box with a better filter like You are using.

The Gran MAF if it is the bench set tuned to cold air intake may help throttle response some but, so will a vortex throttle body spacer that i ran and kept it even with SC on my H2. Most people think they are worthless but, they will improve throttle responce. So in that respect they both will do that. The spacer is just about $150 less than the regular pricing of the Gran MAF. Just based on my experience with a Gran since summer of 1999 i wish i had gone with the throttle body spacer on the 5.3L than the almost double the cost of Gran MAF. The price that the Gran is being offered at Moss I would give it more thought. Even if it just peps up the throttle response just a little it may be worth it for that price.

[CBR_Raven]

Originally Posted by HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ

Screeper I think You are smart staying with the factory box. It was designed to keep water out of intake. Anyone that off roads much I feel would be protecting their engine by using the factory box with a better filter like You are using.

The Gran MAF if it is the bench set tuned to cold air intake may help throttle response some but, so will a vortex throttle body spacer that i ran and kept it even with SC on my H2. Most people think they are worthless but, they will improve throttle responce. So in that respect they both will do that. The spacer is just about $150 less than the regular pricing of the Gran MAF. Just based on my experience with a Gran since summer of 1999 i wish i had gone with the throttle body spacer on the 5.3L than the almost double the cost of Gran MAF. The price that the Gran is being offered at Moss I would give it more thought. Even if it just peps up the throttle response just a little it may be worth it for that price.

will the throttle body spacer do any good if you already have the granatelli MAF?

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

Raven
It does not hurt and the spacer I choose to run is the "Helix Power Tower" by Enhanced Performance Products. The Gran is designed, if You buy the cold air calibrated version, is to try and help get a better balance of fuel and oxygen. It should give You a feel of sharper throttle response. The wideband tuning I'm messing with takes care of all that so I will run the stock MAF till it is time to let the tuning software take over for the MAF.

As I mentioned and have been told by several tuning specialist that if you are going up in boost the factory MAF will work until about 10lbs. of boost so the OEM MAF is no bum piece of equipment. That is the only reason I have not put a Gran MAF on, otherwise a Gran would be on my rig. I will be removing the MAF in boost at some point so no need to spend the money.

The Helix Power Tower is designed for optimum fuel/air mix which the Gran MAF is calibrated to help improve the amounts. The spacer seemed if anything to help the low end which is done by speeding the air flow up and getting the air to spiral more to improve the mix and how fast it gets the blend done before it all gets into the cylinder causing a more powerful firing etc.

I do not see any reason why they should not compliment each other, especially in a non boost situation. I would pick the spacer if forced to choose between the 2 but, since You have the Gran MAF I would not hold back in using the spacer. Each part of the puzzle You can put together is going to all add up at some point to maximize the efficiency of Your engine. Just as with a stock setup I would not hesitate to add MSD coil packs and Taylor wires to maximize the power of the spark to make for a more efficient burn as I can get. The handheld tuner then has it's place in the puzzle as well.

There are allot of add-ons that I have tried before going to SC that when all done together got my rig to run really nice. I got a Magnuson sponsored so I moved into the boost world, plus it looks good for shows. Most of these add-ons have been mentioned in this forum by many. If You would like to PM me I would be glad to try and do my best to give an honest assessment of what you have done and what you may want to do more. No secrets or anything it is just better to discuss Your needs in specific rather than make suggestions in a generalization. The add-ons would come to a more reasonable cost than going to boost and all that goes with tuning for it plus all the gauges You should have to monitor what is going on. Each of us must do what they feel is best for ourself. So I would research others ideas that should be able to be found in a search. Maybe just Google the non boost performance opinions that are all over the net.

Hopefully i have been helpful Raven. If I have confused things rather than clear it up please ask so i do not get You going off into the wrong direction.

TAZ

[tomp]

Hay Taz, you know we tend to mostly agree. However, usually those spacers or twirly things will actually slow down the max flow being allowed to enter the TB. They are for low end, and hurt the top end. It's best to leave them out if you are trying to increase flow rates. They do work well on stock intake where you are trying to only pickup the low end some.

[HUMMERcustoms.com/TAZ]

The spacer I'm talking about goes between the throttle body and intake manifold not in the air intake tube after the MAF. Go to the site listed below and You will see a description of spacer. It does help the low end which with the amount the H2 weighs in at it needs all the low end that you can add to it. I do not know many H2 owners who worry about top end. It is getting a brick with wheels rolling that weighs in at what 7500lbs. If You want more top end then the only real way to get that on a H2 is with a supercharger or turbo. All the different products we use are built to address a certain problem. The real problem in our H2's is lowend.

You will see other things they build. These guys have won SEMA best new product awards for several products. I have been in the manufacturing area to watch the computer controlled machining process. They do all manufacturing in house. They are serious about the equip. they build and distribute to dealers. I live about 20 minutes from them. They still build engines custom for a few people so they can test products in real world. They tease me and ask once I have blown my engine messing around could they build me a motor that will hold up to what ever I want it to do. I'm working on pushing my motor hard as I can to get the new one from them. Problem is like EPP told me that the engine I got will take allot of stress and keep going. Oh well!!

They have a new piston that will be out after more testing. It was revealed at SEMA after patent pending issued. They are still testing them not because they will not do what the piston was designed to do but, wanting to see how it holds up in real world use.

They give anyone that walks in the door advice on building or tuning a motor as long as you have come around enough for them to get to know you. They specialize in GM products but, do develop products to fit other brands. They are the only people I have allowed to work on my H2 besides Dragon or me.

The throttle body spacer is a simple and quick install. They explain the way it works. I trust these guys. They have given me allot of advice for years now when I had a wild idea. Usually my idea ended up being stuff they already to my surprise had in the works patent pending. The new piston I saw the year before they took it to SEMA just to let gearheads see it. They have just handed me new stuff to run and tell them what I think on other rides like my Silverado. They had a handheld tuner for a 2005 H2 on the market called Power Programer 2 months before anyone else did. They have had handhelds out for years. They sold the handheld to Comp Cams. The owner told me for an offer they just could not pass up. I have watched there equipment operate in a test environment to see how the product would function under many conditions.

Anyway have a look at their website and see the stuff they make and sell. I trust them because they have shown me that they are about real performance not just making stuff to throw out on the market to make money on. Many other companies handle their products. In description it will be listed as by Street and Performance Electronics which is the marketng arm of the company also the name they distribute to their dealers. Some may know that name better than the EPP name.

http://www.eperfpro.com/

Mainly I'm just saying You can trust what these guys build. At least until they
prove otherwise. Just check out the Helix Power Tower Plus. I do not get anything out of this except passing info on to my Forum Buds to help all out

[CBR_Raven]

TAZ, thanks for the link. i guess for only $100 bucks, the throttle body spacer would be worth a try

[HUM GOOD]

i was running Granatelli diablo tuner, K&N cold air intake. borla headers and catbacks. My gains were very noticeable. I chose to try the Granatelli MAF sensor. I felt a considerable difference off the line. My throttle response was much quicker, and on the highway the rig runs smoother and quieter with also more passing power when needed.

All in all, I am happy with it.