Canada's Army picks the G-Wagon

[Alan06SUT]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Thai:
US Recon uses G-wagen, not H1. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Whatever dude thats Jack Bower from 24

[MovinH2]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
G-Wagon brings teh suck </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

X2

[Thai]

Here

[tanklizard]

Okay, where to start;
I’ve been in the Army and National Guard for over 17 years and just got back from a year long tour in Iraq this November so I can probably shed some light on this subject.

Right off the bat my biggest problem with the armored G-Wagon is this line:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> A total of 802 G-Wagons and 160 amour protection systems are being supplied to the CF by Mercedes Benz Canada </div></BLOCKQUOTE>.
Armor protection systems, this means the G-Wagon is an up-armored vehicle not an armored vehicle. An up-armored vehicle has had an aftermarket armor kit added to it while an armored vehicle is designed and factory built with armor from the get-go. Why is this important, because a vehicle with an armor kit will never provide as much protection as a vehicle that has been designed to be armored. An armor kit will always have holes and gaps that armor could not be fit around because the original vehicle wasn’t designed with armor in mind. A factory armored vehicle has these gaps eliminated in the design process.

Additionally, a factory armored vehicle has had the rest of the vehicle beefed up to support the armor, up-armored vehicles normally do not. We used two types of Humvee gun trucks in Iraq. The first was the M1025, basically an unarmored scout Humvee that we added an armor kit to. The engine and suspension just couldn’t take the weight. The truck would barely move and every time you hit a pothole you thought something was going to fall off. Here’s a good shot of a 1025, the green is the original truck and the tan is the added armor.


The second type was the M1114. This beast came from the factory already armored and had a more powerful turbo-diesel and beefed up suspension. This was truck people fought to have. The armor was light years ahead of the 1025 (what a death trap.) Here’s a picture of my “Green Machine.”


I didn’t see any mention of upgrading the G-Wagon’s engine or suspension in the article. If you add a ton of armor and leave the rest of the truck alone you’re asking for breakdown after breakdown.

Additionally, adding all that armor raises the vehicle’s center of gravity making it more prone to rollovers. We had this problem with our Humvees, people would drive them like cars, get stupid and roll them over. With a shorter wheelbase and less width the G-Wagon would be more susceptible to rollovers than a Humvee.

Yes the Army is planning to replace the Humvee with a vehicle that will be designed with armor from the start. We’ve known about the underside of the M1114 trapping the effects of a mine blast from day it was fielded . I don’t see where a G-Wagon underside would provide any advantage, it’s wide and flat as well. There’s an old saying “perfect is the enemy of good enough.” If we waited for a perfect vehicle it would never come and we couldn’t afford it if it did. The M1114 is good enough to save lives in Iraq every day. And guess what, a little internet research finds that the G-Wagon is an interim armored vehicle soon to be replaced by a new APV (armored patrol vehicle.) To quote the article:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But it was obvious from the outset that G-wagon’s add- on amour would give insufficient protection from landmines or improvised explosive devices. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Trying to compare a G-Wagon to a Humvee is like comparing a Humvee to a jeep or even a land rover, apples to oranges. The Humvee replaced much more than the jeep, it replaced several light vehicles (gamma goat, mule, etc.) with a single, common vehicle. All the G-wagon and jeep can do is haul 4 people and a light load of equipment. The Humvee can haul up to 4,400 lbs., evacuate 4 wounded soldiers on stretchers, and move troops.

In Iraq, the army as already started replacing the M1114 in some of its roles with two, new, specialized vehicles.

MP units in heavy (read that tank) divisions have been receiving the M1117 ASV (armored security vehicle.) It’s basically an armored car with heavier armor and weapons (a ma deuce and MK-19) than the M1114. It also weighs more, costs a lot more, and can’t move troops or equipment like a Humvee. Here’s a pic I took of one at LSA Anaconda:


The second vehicle the army is using is the RG-31 Mine Protected Vehicle. It’s a South African armored car that is better protected than the M1114 because it has heavier armor and a boat shaped hull to deflect explosive blasts. Engineers use these during route clearance when they sweep the roads for IED’s. Saw several in theater but didn’t take any pics so here’s the one from the website:


The engineers are also using another armored vehicle to do route clearance, the buffalo (American made.) This truck isn’t replacing the Humvee but I thought I’d show it to you anyways. This monster weighs 23 tons (heavy, heavy armor.) and has a long hydraulic arm with a camera and rake at the end of it. Whenever they see something suspicious, they’ll drive up and poke it with the arm. If it’s an IED and it goes off, they’ve got a good 20ft of standoff space and 23 tons of armor to protect them. Here’s a pic of one on my FOB:


And last but not least, I’d like to address this post:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">US Recon uses G-wagen, not H1. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
BULL****!!!
United States reconnaissance units use either the M1114, a Stryker, or the walk. They do not use G-Wagons in any way shape or form. All I see is a picture of an American soldier standing in front of a G-Wagon. How did you come to your conclusion from this picture? How do you know he isn’t just posing in front of a G-wagon? I learned a long time ago to keep my mouth shut when I don’t know what I’m talking about. You should do the same.

[Thai]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VTSTOMPER:
I guess I am the orginal poster...I hope you didn't think I was talking smack about your G-Wagon by posting it. I thought it was pretty wild seeing a "greened out" G-Wagon. All I see are black ones covered with more chrome than anything else. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No offense at all. I was just following up on your post with update about G-wagen's action in Afgan.

As for the mall crawlers...i sadly agree...too many bling-bling G's around.

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KenP:
I didn't know Canada had an Army. I just thought we took care of them. Those trucks are really for pulling their horse trailers. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

They're highly trained at repelling Eskimo attacks.

[Ed G.]

Hell, they have to look good when they retreat don't they.

[KenP]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by timgco:
At least ther forest service will be driving H2's. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Shut it Mr. H3er.

[DDWH]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MovinH2:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
G-Wagon brings teh suck </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

X2 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

X3

[KenP]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DennisAJC:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tanklizard:
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is the first time I've witnessed an American Soldier sniper a Charlie on teh web. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>That brings teh funnay.

[Thai]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DRTYFN:
Thai for sure got all butt hurt about the perceived slight. He's got really thin skin but likes to talk big. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Now, Drifty, be nice...i think that EVERYONE here knows how sensitive you and your boyfriends get.

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Thai:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Alec W:
I said think, as in I am not 100% sure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And i said...STFU. Can YOU read? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

[DRTYFN]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
Oh, it get's worse. That article is from like 2002 or 2003. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
BUWAHAHAHA!!!!! I was so dead on about this turd being a DEE DEE DEE!!!