Ocean City Maryland beach hummer accident

[tower]

Shag,

Just change you screen name or open a new account as shaggy jeep (shabby jeep? shabby cheap? the other shaggy? the smarter shaggy? you get the idea) or something like that. We'll knkow who you are. Drop the concern about being blocked. If we have tolerated Hummoron for this long, we're certainly not going to cut you.

As far as not having seconds reported on the coordinates, that is another specious arguement. The coordinates given peg the location about 1/4 mile off shore. At that point, you call the boats and choppers out. You do not decide that this very specific location "might be far enough off to be somewhere on shore, so let's not initiate the ICS. No one even TRIED using the coordinates to get a location that night. This is just more after the fact BS in an attempt to cover behinds.

[Marcmedic]

Someone stuck in the sand vs. someone screaming in the background after a distress button was pushed should have provoked a different response.

[LasVegas]

Originally posted by H2Finally:
LasVegas, while I feel that I comprehend your point, nevertheless, the analogy seemed inaccurate. A plane crash is often immediately fatal. Not so in this Hummer accident.

H2Finally...I'm afraid you're proving my point. First, you only see those major headline stories where an airliner crashes and kills 175 people. There are many many other accidents of less significance with survivors that you never hear about so the analogy is sound IMO. Flying, 4 wheeling, or driving in Las Vegas is not inherently safe and the actions & judgement of the responsible operator causes death, not those that attempt to save them from their poor judgement. Should emergency services be held responsible for their actions? Absolutely. Should they be held 100% responsible for deaths caused by someone elses poor judgement because they didn't execute perfectly? Absolutely not. This is not a perfect world, but it would be a lot closer if more people would take full responsibility for their own actions. However, you are correct on the "cause" of death vs possible "saving". But their possible saving will forever be subject to debate where the reason the deaths happened appears to be absolute. In the not too distant past EMS & Rescue Services as we know them today didn't even exist and now we try to cloud our irresponsible acts with their performance.

[DRTYFN]

Ok, you can let this thread go away now.

[KenP]

Just wondering, what do the Rangers have to do between 9:30pm and 8am? Sure, in the morning people are coming through, but what about in the middle of the night. I think, if nothing else, curiosity would get me out there driving along the beach checking things out. What were they doing?

[KenP]

38.21 latitude and -75.14 longitude.

Looks wet to me. Something weird happened up there.
http://geography.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mapquest.com%2Fm aps%2Flatlong.adp

[dochummer]

Didn't they have the vehicle's number? Could they have called it to follow up on the vehicle themselves?

[beachinJeeper]

Okay, with the advice of legal council, and the desire to some, name changed. As the Rolling Stones once sang "please allow me to introduce myself"

shaggy is now beachinJeeper, and wishes all a Happy Holiday (and don't mean to offend those of differring beliefs).

Still would like to get more facts out into the open and to the public, and maybe one day they will.

Still looking to see if I can find out if vehicle was in the Federal or State portion of the Island, could answer some questions, maybe not many, but

Have Jeep will travel

[Marcmedic]

No, I think you've found blatant stupidity simply by looking in the mirror.

[beachinJeeper]

Gee, and I just figured the real reason he wanted me gone was that I drive an '87 Jeep Wrangler, and not my name, cause this is a Hummer board, but thanks H2 Rocks, me just wanting to find the facts, and give what info I can about AI and the rangers.

Can't respond about Linda's post, since it was deleted before I read it, but will say stripersonline is just a bunch of fishermen with four wheel drives that, well hang out and fish. Just seems many times things happen, and the consequences are less than appealing to us. Maybe part of our fear is, enough happens there, we lose our priveledges to fish all night, may be selfish, but that is our escape, and night time is the right time for fishing, just not the time for learning the beach. Also, I believe after dark, people on the beach must be actively fishing, not real sure there, might just be a reference to the fact that no sleeping on the beach after dark, but dozing off during sunlight hours while tanning is permissible.

Have Jeep will travel

[Marcmedic]

And by the way, OnStar makes a promise to inform Police/Fire/EMS in the case of an emergency...which they did. I wasn't aware that on your planet of stupidity that a private business should have to monitor government agencies to make sure they do their damn jobs. You're an idiot, plain and simple. I actually think we're all dumber from reading your posts.

[PARAGON]

Shaggy,

I think maybe you are not seeing the point trying to be made by most here. The Rangers did not do enough. That's indisputable because 2 people are dead that might otherwise would not have been. That's not to say that the individual Rangers are to blame, I don't think anyone here knows enough to state that. The Rangers were the last component of this emergency operation and failed to find them, it's that simple. It's the why that has most here concerned.

Everyone here does know that the driver likely caused his accident and put he and his passenger in the precarious situation. Bad judgement happens every day and sometimes results in this type of accident and we rely on emergency services to provide help in those situations. There was a breakdown here. The vehicle's coordinates were given but not used and there was no attempt to re-connect with the vehicle using the Onstar system. The Rangers, quite frankly, should not have been searching the entire island to begin with. They should have first zeroed in on the coordinates provided to the 911 operator but the Ranger that took the call from the 911 operator did not take the coordinates down and use them.

Maybe some of you don't understand about Onstar and that that is part of the reason for our concern. We pay a fee to have this Onstar service for emergency situations like what transpired on that island and depend upon that system and the subsequent emergency services because Onstar can GPS locate our vehicle in the event of such an emergency. This valuable tool was ignored altogether in this situation.

[tower]

Okay. As someone who is currently active in search and Rescue on a regular basis, I feel compelled to say a couple of things. Not having heard the actual tapes, and not being familiar with that part of the country, my comments will be few.

First, I agree that the OnStar operator could have been more emphatic about the significance of the coordinates. I differ with others in that I find GPS coordinates to be tremendously accurate and very helpful even when used for "last sighted" information. He/She also could have given a detailed description of the vehicle make, model, color. license plate number, drivers name, etc. That might have prevented the ranger's possible assumtion that finding "anybody that needed help" or "a couple... stuck in the sand" had disposed of the issue.

Clearly, the rangers didn't realize the seriousness of an OnStar distress call. So probably, there is a gap in their education.

Moreover, most agencies employ an ICS or Incident Command System, whereby no single individual calls off a search without input from a site commander and many other involved parties and agencies. If this system had been used, there probably would have been FLIR equipped helicopters looking for these two in very short order. It is impossible for me to say if this would have been life-saving.

I don't think there is any one person or agency upon whom we can place all the blame. But God knows, I would want things to run a lot more smoothly if I had a loved one out there in distress.

Echoing what others wrote, let's all keep it safe.

[LasVegas]

Paragon

by Jonahs... However, if the investigation ultimately shows that they were in fact somehow negligent in carrying out their duties in accordance with the standards set for them, they too will pay a price. And if that proves true, new standards will be set that will possibly save lives in the future.

by Jonahs.... Should emergency services be held responsible for their actions? Absolutely. Should they be held 100% responsible for deaths caused by someone elses poor judgement because they didn't execute perfectly? Absolutely not.

And the analogy applies 100%. There is no difference in responsibility between a pilot flying an aircraft and you or anyone else driving your H2. And I can assure you that when you board an aircraft you want to feel secure that the pilot is competent and responsible. Unfortunately that's greatly diminished these days with people and vehicles.

And yes, this thread is too long.

[4churchill]

Let's not let this guy get us all riled up. I would suggest we all just ignore him.

[Kevin B]

I am glad to see they are not going to close any more areas down or restrict the rules. As I recall that wasn't the problem, it was communication.

[Hummoron]

That would absolve him of driving crazy, not of making a bed decision and going where it was not legal.

Regardless of the first two, he was still driving in a non-vehicle area. He should not have been where he was. Had he been, the initial search may have been much more successful.

Do the hummers have black boxes to record the driver?! That could really shed a lot of light onto this.

[Linda]

t~

THANK YOU, what a wonderful response.

-Linda

[H2Finally]

t, OUTSTANDING! Your reply is concise, credible, and (rare in this forum) mature. Drinks on me, buddy!

Hummoron, it is one thing to trash Hummers (it's only a vehicle), but another entirely to speak so lightly about the death of human beings. With so little respect of life, we are not interested in your opinions; but the FBI might.

[DRTYFN]

There's a point to all of this.

She continues to drone on about this tragedy, trying desperately to draw attention to herself. Why does she need to come in here, of all places, to "vent her grief"? Does the word "stalker" mean anything to you? She hasn't offered one god damn bit of information on the subject other than to exaggerate about spending her "whole life" with the guy. Her incessant whining & attention-whoring is really pissing me off.

You want an example of a true tradegy? Go to Pirate4X4 and look up the thread where the guy's wife, that had been suffering from mental illness, disappeared only to turn up dead after committing suicide. He has 2 small children to raise by himself after loosing his wife to a much more tragic event. He doesn't continue to bring it up over and over again. And he's been a member on the god damn board for a lot f*cking longer than this carpet-bagging interloper(meaning 1).

So you'll forgive me if my patience ran out days ago on these people that feel obligated to come in here to "defend the honor" of the Poor Darwin Award winner. Hell, if it were my friend, or even just an acquaintance, that had, say, wrapped his BMW around a tree, I wouldn't be going into BMW forums to cry about it for friggin days and weeks on end. Once is explainable, but this never-ending spotlight of stalking has got to end.