Any 1911 fans on the board?

[Toadies]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Beastmaster:
Hmm..the Glock Kaboom! FAQ. Wow.

. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Indeed. Nothing like having your pistol blow up in time of need.

Most LE are forced by departments to carry those ****ty pieces because Mr.Glock sucks major LE cawk. They practically give them to departments compared to Kimbers, HKs, Sigs, etc.

I wouldn't use one for a doorstop.

[H3OwnerDiz]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DRTYFN:
This Toadies = AE for some dickhead </div></BLOCKQUOTE> Walc is in the building. Just a guess...

[Mr. I - Man]

Heavy, outdated. Works well as a paper weight or if you run out of rounds you can throw it at your enemy.

[Beastmaster]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bondage:

Enjoy your new weapon. I think you've made an outstanding choice, now practice, practice, practice! You were too kind to call our rambling nonesense "advice." But take what Beastmaster said to heart - he is, IMHO, dead on. Go back and re-read his last post. I agree 110%.

Sean </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Drills are the key. It's called muscle memory, and if you do the drills over and over and over - your gross motor skills will react properly and by the numbers under stress every single time. This is the basis for most successful training programs that combining firearms and stress mangement.

I've got a funny story about muscle memory, rather recent, in fact.

My stress relief is practicing a rather esoteric martial art called Krav Maga. We had an out of state instructor come by to demonstrate disarming techiques.

Utilizing ASP Red Training guns, we practiced the movements. Then came the drills using real "training" weapons - firearms with plugged barrels, no magazines, and no firing pins. The pistol in this case was a Beretta 92.

The out of state instructor (who instructs with LAPD SWAT) was the guy I was paired with. Figures. And he was the armed person.

Now - when you're doing pistol takeaways, rule #1 is: The gun will go off! Most takeaways will have you grasp the pistol in the area of the ejector port to cause a jam when the pistol discharges. Well, in my former life's training, when you take away the pistol, you rack the slide twice (done to clear and put the pistol back into battery), come up to target, and assess. (Of course, I won't talk about situations where you back into a semi-auto pistol!)

Well, that's what I did. Everyone started asking me why I did that. Then came the real life versus dojo training discussion.

So - muscle memory done years ago for 3 1/2 years straight still applies and is remembered over 10 years later. It did cause the group to discuss stuff that the instructors really didn't want to cover, but the point is that doing drills over and over again until they are second nature will put you in good stead.

I do have a bad story about the same clearing drill. I was a particpant in an introductory IPSC shoot. The fake sceneario was an interesting one where you grabbed any loaded pistol on the table and started shooting the selected targets. On the table were three revolvers and one Sig P228 semi-auto.

The Sig got a stovepipe jam on the second target. Muscle memory said for me to cycle twice and continue. That's what I did. Floor rules for that day's shoot was to halt after all jams. I got DQ'ed. So there are times where real life drills sometimes conflict with competition rules.

[PARAGON]

I didn't "knock" the 1911 per se. It's just not a good carry weapon for most applications. It is indeed heavy, is not very concealable, is more cumbersome on the draw, etc. It is about the application.

Advice is being discussed here and one has to take into account that you are talking an averaging of individuals and situations and what would fit most. A 1911 style just simply is not a friendly platform for a carry. I have an original Colt from WWII with the heavy, slopply trigger. But, I personally do not think the platform is the right one for the average person on a PD level.

Bondage, before you try to mouth off in any way, I would suggest you get your ducks in a row. Toadies made some comment about most engagements being made within 21 feet, hence my reference to feet. A handgun is for personal defense, period. You can't go around with an AR15 and a shotgun slung on your shoulders for personal protection. Optimum personal protection is to keep the target as far away as you are accurate and effective with your weapon. Since you can keep a target at much distance with a rifle it is the first choice of arms, second would be the shotgun, then the handgun, knife and lastly hand-to-hand. Since the first option most can have available to them at all times is the handgun, it is best to choose the one handgun that is the most applicable to the most possible situations. The fact that one can accurately engage a target further away and with more ammunition available without reload puts them at an advantage over the target in most situations.

At 5-10 feet the energy of the rounds of most large caliber handguns are sufficient to stop the target, so that is really a moot point as long as you have a handgun that is easily controlled in such an tense situation. You are no longer shooting at a paper target and taking out as many variables that would result in a miss or failed engagement has to be employed. This is why the Glock was developed. It is the easiest pistol to use and has a smooth profile.

[Mr. I - Man]

The Marines who used the 1911 as a service piece were way before my time. I served from 1993 - 2002. I never said it was a bad pistol.I never stated anything but the obvious, The 1911 is a great weapon for its day. It is a little heavy and the bullet drop and capacity in my opinion does not make up for little bit more in stopping power over the 40 S.W. It just does not fit my needs. And thats my personal choice.

[Harley]

Steve, I agree entirely... I shoot IPSC with a G35 so I don't switch between guns too often (other than a ccw)... ( I personally carry a G22 at work). I've dumped thousands and thousands of rounds through that gun and it did fail once, we think it was d/t a jacked up reloaded round... and the weapon did just what it was supposed to... it dumped the mag (yes it spanked my hand) and expelled the gasses downward. I replaced the extractor that got knocked off, got a new mag and was ready for the next stage... same gun.

[Petey]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Toadies:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:
BLAH BLAH BLAH BLATHER BLATHER BLATHER </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

the basis of your arguements throughout this thread is the military adopted the M9 due to a perceived lacking in range and accuracy on with the 1911. you are wrong and very stupid to keep blathering your bull**** opining about what does not constitute a valid tactical situation. again, you = wannabe CQB man..

You are the only one who is dazzled with your pretend military experience and tactical expertise. Most LEs and operators would laugh at your dumbass as most likely half this board is not counting your sackriders.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>Ok </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Another stunning comeback from PARAQUEER..

PARAQUEER ladies and gentlemen....

[Toadies]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PARAGON:

If you want to be stupid with your own life, fine. Otherwise, move on and quit giving advice here on crap you know nothing about on something as important as this. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


RAAARRR!!!!1 I am a goddamn navy bellhop and I know all...

RAAARRRRR!!!!1

[Harley]

...careful there, toad... Most "Tactical" engagements involve the use of M4 rifles or MP5, in my experience... I wouldn't walk into anything w/ just a handgun intentionally. I carry glocks at work and Kimber Ultra CDP off duty.

[Bondage]

You gotta understand this - guns are like off road machines - the Jeepers hate the Hummers, the Glockenspeils hate the 1911ers, etc., etc., etc. It's all bullshiite. Stick with the best brands, (Glock, HK, Kimber, Springfield, Beretta, Sig, etc) and SHOOT 'em all. A lot. Then stick with the one that feels most comfortable to you and that you shoot the best. Be sparing with the modifications (again, like an off road machine) and it will be a reliable machine. I have an original COLT Combat Government in .45acp that has had the piss shot out of it. Untold thousands of rounds (yeah, get a Dillon reloading press) and it is as reliable and accurate and awesome as it was on day one. If pressed for a particular weapon as a recommendation, I'd have to side with the Wilson CQB as previously mentioned. Then do NO mods and just shoot it, and shoot it, and shoot it, and shoot it........


Sean

[Mr. I - Man]

Quote : " Follow Me"????

Were you a Ranger??

Just wondering because when I was a group of us Marines and Navy got to participate in a Ranger school package It was to help with better unit coheasion during J.T.F. missions.

Anyways the instructors were always saying that.

[Mr. I - Man]

quote: Glockies are best with factory ammo.. Even Gaston says so...


Hey hillbilly Texan don't you know how to read. I don't have a F*&king Glock I have a H&k USP 40SW. I guess the literacy rate is not to good down there.

[KenP]

Paragon, I forgot to tell you I like you carry weapon.

[Humgirl&guy]

Here in canada we cannot carry handguns, Just shotguns and beer!

[ssgharkness020147]

Well I rolled over the magic 21 a few months back, and the time is fast approaching to pick up a handgun. I have already settled on a 1911 chambered in 45 like they should be. But, I'm pretty torn on brands, I have looked at the Springfields, they make some nice looking guns, but I keep hearing love hate stories about them. I've glanced at the STI's, but have not found that much info on them. I'm not the biggest Kimber fan, they make some nice guns, but I'm going to pass on Kimber this go around. And finally there is the Wilson Combat. That's what I'm leaning twoards, does anyone on the board have a Wilson, or experience with them? I'm almost positive that the Wilson will prevail, but I'm open to other suggestions. Off the bat I'll be taking the gun down to the range alot, I'm thinking about getting into IPSC. I would not mind having something I could have in the truck sometimes as well, but not a specific defense gun. Are there any good 1911 boards out there? Any guidence would be appreciated.

[Petey]

most marines being of the limp wristed variety need a weapon with a light kick.. not too stunning and a flat trajectory to stay on target

[Mr. I - Man]

Thanks Paragon! Well put.

[Toadies]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bondage:


In any courtroom in the U.S. today, 25 yards sounds more like murder than self-defense! I love the .45acp +p 230 grain round - especially as offered in the Hydra-Shock or Golden Sabre rounds. I will admit, however, that just about any manufacturer's .357mag in a 125gr JHP is about the ultimate manstopper. Sean </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree on your murder charge over 25 feet. Any DA will take that and your love for weapons and take you to a Grand Jury any day of the week.

The .357 is good at penetrating auto glass but thats it's only advantage.

[PARAGON]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Toadies:
Most people can't shoot so sure give em a 9mm pussy gun. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>We're on the same page, Bond.

Toadshiit, the US Armed Forces converted use from the .45 cal to the 9mm because of the range issue. As I understand things now, all Berettas are being worked out of service and replaced with SIG 229R DAK .40 cals because of the compromise of down-range energy and accuracy.

Storydud, you can't win an argument if the facts were written for you. Certainly you can't talk about guns or wheeling. Give it a rest, storyhut.