Buying new pistol, need advice

[evldave]

ok, here's my deal. I have a shotgun, which I use mostly for hunting, but w/slug & 0000 shot works well for home defense (behind the locks and my 2 75# dogs).

What I'm looking for now, is a pistol, something I can carry w/me. I used to have Karr .40 cal w/3.5" barrel. Honestly, I hated it - too short barrel, plus a trigger/double-pull safety. I'm not too interested in home safety, with the dogs & shotgun. If I was, I've but a 15 round .22 w/hollow points - about a good as a home defense pistol as you can find (behind the shotgun).

What I need is a pistol (not revolver, hate 'em), with >6 round clip, with a real safety, with a >4" barrel, that can stop a bear/wolf/cougar/etc. I'll use it mostly for personal protection in my car, but want a single gun for both traveling protection + camping/outdoors. I was in Alaska a couple years ago and ended up 10' from a black bear. Everything worked out, but I have had a run-in w/the shotgun where my brother and I dumped 6 rounds of 4 shot into a small black bear while pheasant hunting near Yakima WA. I never want to be that freaked out again - I want a pistol I trust to take care of that for me. Pull it and shoot, no worries.

Without a bunch of BS about gun safety (I'm comfortable w/guns, been shooting them for 15 years), what's the best gun for my needs under $700? I don't mind used, don't need a laser sight, won't use it for target practice, can shoot quite well under pressure, and just need something with stopping power. Thanks.

[DRTYFN]

Can't go wrong with a nice Glock. Maintenance-free and nice to shoot.

[Big Z]

No no-sense stoppers! get a 45 or 50 cal auto!

[KenP]

Originally Posted by DRTYFN

Can't go wrong with a nice Glock. Maintenance-free and nice to shoot.

I love our Glock, but our Taurus PT-945 with Magsafe's will put a real hurtin' on a bear.

I did a short search and didn't find anything negative about the gun, but I'm sure there are some.

Link to forum about it:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=1449

[MarineHawk]

I agree with DRTY - it's hard to beat a Glock as an all-around gun. If I had to pick just one handgun for all purposes, I'd probably pick my Glock 27 - it holds ten potent .40 S&W rounds, has a 3.5" barrell, recoils less than any other .40 S&W I have shot (I own 6 of them) yet is smaller than a Walther PPK/S.
Yet, respecting your perceived need for an external safety, semi-auto, and 4"+ barrell, my favorite with those limitations would be this in .40S&W: http://www.hecklerkoch-usa.com/index...tNumber=704501.
I've had one since 1994. It's worked flawlessly ever since, and shoots better than I do.

Of course, IMO, you'd be crazy to be in many parts of Alaska where the Griz and Brown bear roam with anything less than a .44 Mag revolver. If I were in the Alaska wildernesses, and if I really didn't want to carry a rifle around, I'd probably have one of these: http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firear...=5505&return=Y in .454 Casull.
The .44 Mag-and-greater semi-autos, while novel are kind of silly IMO.

[Racer-X]

I did a lot of research when I bought my pistol for the same reasons. I was doing a lot of backwoods hiking. If you want to stop a bear of any size a .357 or 44 mag is the ticket. Better yet is what I carry now - bear spray.

[The Juice]

Be a man. Use a knife.

[ssgharkness020147]

If you want to be able to stop a bear the lowest cal you should be looking at is the 45. Period. .40's are great guns with good stopping power, but we are talking about bears not people a bear will require more. Honestly I dont think you need advise about A pistol, but rather (2) pistols. You want one gun to serve for personal protection and extreme circumstances and I dont really think you are going to find a single gun to suit both rolls. But if you only want to buy one gun for both purposes my vote is for a .45.

[PARAGON]

Well, we be at it again.

No, a .45 is no better for bear than a .40 would be. Simple ballistics. If you stuffed some grains of powder behind that .45, we'd be talking a different story. It's not just only the caliber of the projectile that matters.

Secondly, and going all the way back up to the top. Evldave, you need to seek advice from some professionals. Because your statement about a .22 being as good as any home defense pistol, is, well, just ignorant.

The rest of it, is just silly, IMO.

[MarineHawk]

Originally Posted by PARAGON

No, a .45 is no better for bear than a .40 would be. Simple ballistics. If you stuffed some grains of powder behind that .45, we'd be talking a different story.

Exactly. Both calibers can be bought with well-designed bullets of similar weight (the .45 comes in higher weights, such as the 230 gr FMJ, but they are neither the most powerful, nor most effective .45 loads). Thus, the kinetic energy (that's what kills & disrupts things) of these cartridges provides a fair estimate of their stopping power. The most powerful loads most mfrs offer in these two cartridges are a 155 gr load with 447 ft-lbs of energy in the .40 S&W and a 476 ft-lbs 165 gr load in the .45 Auto. 29 extra ft-lbs of energy in a bullet of comparable weight can't possibly make one a big bear killer and one merely a personal defense cartridge. Further, each of the mfrs lists the test barrel for the .40 is as 4" and the test barrel for the .45 as 5" (e.g., compare at http://www.federalcartridge.com/ball...firearm=2&s1=1 ). Going from a 4" to a 5" barrel would likely add about 40 ft/sec of velocity to the .40 load (from 1140 to about 1180), which would yield an energy of 482 ft-lbs for the .40. Thus, it you're shooting the .40 and the .45 out of the same length barrel the .40 probably has MORE energy than the .45. Corbon, is one rare example of a mfr who sells hotter loads. It's most power full .40 puts out 526 ft-lbs out of a 4" barrel and its most powerful .45 puts out 573 ft-lbs from a 5" barrel ( http://www.dakotaammo.net/products/corbon/convjhp.htm ). Again a negligible difference, especially if you even the barrel lengths. And a .357 only puts out from .480 to 570 ft-lbs depending on the load. Thus, I can't see how it's incredibly superior to either the .40 or .45 -- other than that it has the word "magnum" in its name.

A .454 Cassull can hit something with 1,900 ft-lbs of energy in a 7.5" barrel (a .44 mag also puts out about a 1,000 ft-lbs of energy). Either are much preferable to a .40, .45, or .357 when facing a bear of any size. All that being said, I'd much rather have a .40 or a .45 when facing a bear than either (1) nothing at all or (2) some pepper spray.

[f5fstop]

If a safety is a requirement, a Tarus or a H&K. Caliber is up to you, but if it is a grizzly, I would use nothng smaller than a S&W .50

[CO Hummer]

Originally Posted by DRTYFN

Can't go wrong with a nice Glock. Maintenance-free and nice to shoot.

X2!!!!

Glocks all the way. Get a G23, a nice snappy .40 cal.

I've been shooting Glocks for years and have NEVER, EVER had a jam or misfire.

[PARAGON]

Originally Posted by CO Hummer

X2!!!!

Glocks all the way. Get a G23, a nice snappy .40 cal.

I've been shooting Glocks for years and have NEVER, EVER had a jam or misfire.

You have not shot enough then

[CO Hummer]

Originally Posted by PARAGON

You have not shot enough then

wrong!

[PARAGON]

Originally Posted by CO Hummer

wrong!

wronger

[Racer-X]

And a .357 only puts out from .480 to 570 ft-lbs depending on the load. Thus, I can't see how it's incredibly superior to either the .40 or .45 -- other than that it has the word "magnum" in its name.

I once had a bear take off running when he read "magnum" on the side of my gun.

[Wisha Haddan H3]

I agree with all the comments so far about bullet weight and power. But your best bet is to rent some pistols at a local range and try different ammo. Accuracy depends on the ammo and how it fits your hand.

I like a SA/DA semi-auto pistol with half-moon sights that fits snug in my hand, unsafes easily and doesn't snag on the draw. Don't care for Glocks and Rugers, but give me a full-size Beretta, dehorned model 1911, or my old EEA .45 and I'm good to go.

For bear-stopping power, load ammo you use and trust, .40 caliber +Ps or higher. When I first bought my EAA Witness .45, I loaded it with +P+ JHPs. Even with the ported barrel, it kicked like a mule and ruined my followup shots. I switched to regular +P and my double-taps improved.

[MarK M]

no need for big calibers... just get more magazines... its fun to unload with multiple mags.

they will eventually go down!

BTW, dont wait until he charges. When they stand up start unloading. you get a nice clean shot of the soft side.

[Mr. I - Man]

Fvck it go with a Wildey .475 Mag

[KenP]

I want a bullet that'll bounce around in the criminal's body for a little while.