Engine for H3 is disappointing

[Kahloq]

Anyone else here think the I-5 is too small?
Granted, it should not have an engine that prodices more power/torque then what the H2 has, BUT, i is a HUMMER. It should have something better then the Colorado midsize pickup.
At least an option to put a real v6 with maybe 250 HP or maybe a small v8 producing say around 280HP. IMO, putting a 5 cyclinder engine in it, does not do justice to the name HUMMER.
Why not use something like what Jeep did with the 5.7 hemi in the Grand Cherokee. When at idle or highway speeds, 4 cyclinders deactivate and it runs on 4 cylinders to get better fuel mileage.
Since the H3 is a HUMMER, it should have a v8 period. Having an i-5 definitly makes it sound like a soccer mom vehicle

[Kahloq]

Anyone else here think the I-5 is too small?
Granted, it should not have an engine that prodices more power/torque then what the H2 has, BUT, i is a HUMMER. It should have something better then the Colorado midsize pickup.
At least an option to put a real v6 with maybe 250 HP or maybe a small v8 producing say around 280HP. IMO, putting a 5 cyclinder engine in it, does not do justice to the name HUMMER.
Why not use something like what Jeep did with the 5.7 hemi in the Grand Cherokee. When at idle or highway speeds, 4 cyclinders deactivate and it runs on 4 cylinders to get better fuel mileage.
Since the H3 is a HUMMER, it should have a v8 period. Having an i-5 definitly makes it sound like a soccer mom vehicle

[Kahloq]

Anyone else here think the I-5 is too small?
Granted, it should not have an engine that prodices more power/torque then what the H2 has, BUT, i is a HUMMER. It should have something better then the Colorado midsize pickup.
At least an option to put a real v6 with maybe 250 HP or maybe a small v8 producing say around 280HP. IMO, putting a 5 cyclinder engine in it, does not do justice to the name HUMMER.
Why not use something like what Jeep did with the 5.7 hemi in the Grand Cherokee. When at idle or highway speeds, 4 cyclinders deactivate and it runs on 4 cylinders to get better fuel mileage.
Since the H3 is a HUMMER, it should have a v8 period. Having an i-5 definitly makes it sound like a soccer mom vehicle

[PARAGON]

Maybe you should familiarize yourself with the Hummer lineage. The H1 and Humvees have always had weak engines. A high output engine is not a "Hummer" thing.

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PARAGON:
Maybe you should familiarize yourself with the Hummer lineage. The H1 and Humvees have always had weak engines. A high output engine is not a "Hummer" thing. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ummm no offense, but maybe you need to look at the engine specs. The H2 V8 produces 325 HP for the 05 model yr. That is not a small amount and is not weak. The H1 is a deisel engine and operates differently. HP is not comparable. A semi truck that has 310 HP is not weak and is usually a v6 and is deisel, yet can pull 40,000+ pounds in a trailer. The H1 has 205 HP on a deisel engine. The H1 is not built for drag racing, but for pulling and/or climbing.

I never said anything about HIGH output motors now did I? No! You mistake new person to forums for someone with little to no knowledge? What I said was something better then the Colorado pickup. There are plenty of v6 motors making well more then the 250HP I suggested. There are far more v8 motors that produce well over 280HP as I had suggested. Why is that hard to reason? The Hummer is supposed to be about toughness, name recognition, etc. yet it has an I-5 engine? The two don't match.

[PARAGON]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kahloq:
Ummm no offense, but maybe you need to look at the engine specs. The H2 _V8_ produces 325 HP for the 05 model yr. That is not a small amount and is not weak. The H1 is a deisel engine and operates differently. HP is not comparable. A semi truck that has 310 HP is not weak and is usually a v6 and is deisel, yet can pull 40,000+ pounds in a trailer. The H1 has 205 HP on a deisel engine. The H1 is not built for drag racing, but for pulling and/or climbing.

I never said anything about HIGH output motors now did I? No! You mistake new person to forums for someone with little to no knowledge? What I said was something better then the Colorado pickup. There are plenty of v6 motors making well more then the 250HP I suggested. There are far more v8 motors that produce well over 280HP as I had suggested. Why is that hard to reason? The Hummer is supposed to be about toughness, name recognition, etc. yet it has an I-5 engine? The two don't match. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No offense taken but I make no mistake in reference to your posts. So one HP rating is not comparable to another HP rating? I'll leave that alone because it is stupid enough as it is. HP is not the rating most off-roaders or "semi" owners are as concerned with. It's torque. And, please, at least do some research before you spout ignorance. A "semi truck" does not usually have a V6.

I never said anything about a new person with little to no knowledge now did I? No! '

I am not opining on the H3's engine one way or the other. I am simply pointing out that the Hummer line is not one known for "power" and has a very low power-to-weight ratio. It's not that hard of a concept to understand.

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PARAGON:
No offense taken but I make no mistake in reference to your posts. So one HP rating is not comparable to another HP rating? I'll leave that alone because it is stupid enough as it is. HP is not the rating most off-roaders or "semi" owners are as concerned with. It's torque. And, please, at least do some research before you spout ignorance. A "semi truck" does not usually have a V6.

I never said anything about a new person with little to no knowledge now did I? No! '

I am not opining on the H3's engine one way or the other. I am simply pointing out that the Hummer line is not one known for "power" and has a very low power-to-weight ratio. It's not that hard of a concept to understand. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well before you start telling ppl to do more research, you should do it yourself. I DRIVE semi's for a living and everyone of the trucks in out fleet is a 6 cylinder engine. There are few if any 8 cylinder highway deisel engines for semi's. Yes I made a typo when I said V6 and meant inline 6, but you knew what I meant.
You made my point when you said truck owners are concerend with torque more then HP. Thats exactly true and that is why the H1 with 205 HP is not comparable to another line of truck with 300+ HP. The H1 is designed for pulling and climbing..period.

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sfox:
Listen Newbie, the reason the H2 exists is to sell a crap-load of trucks, the reason the H3 will exist is to sell a crap-load of trucks....plain and simple.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So, you call anyone that has a different view then you a newb. How very welcoming. Vomits. If this is the type of ppl that exist here, then this isn't a valuable forum.

[PARAGON]

I don't care to make you look more stupid. Why should I take the credit for soemthing you've done so well yourself?

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PARAGON:
I don't care to make you look more stupid. Why should I take the credit for soemthing you've done so well yourself? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, because Ive said nothing to make myself look stupid regardless of what you try to say to cover up a fact that i am right regarding the torque and HP regarding deisel engines. You jsut cant accept that.

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sfox:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kahloq:

So, you call anyone that has a different view then you a newb. How very welcoming. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ummmm, it's got nothing to do with your view, you only have 7 posts...it even says rookie under your name. Besides, you are the one that got all defensive when not everybody agreed with you. As to welcoming you, I don't think you have been treated any different than anybody else, sorry if we hurt your feelings. Let's try again:

_Welcome Kaloq!! Please tell me more about a truck that neither of us has driven yet and that we are all simply postulating on it's power to weight ratio._

Since you are so unwilling to listen to "Hummer" owners (I have an H2, Paragon has an H2, and PhilD has had both and H1 and currently has an H2....which do you have?) then you stating what makes a truck a Hummer to Hummer owners is sort of silly isn't it. Your opinion was not being ripped to shreds or anything, it simply sparked a discussion to which you got very defensive. A word of advise, if you don't like having people be critical or discussing your opinion, then don't offer it.

BTW as to the H1 pulling stuff, both the H1 and the H2 are at best average at pulling and towing .

S <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

How did I get defensive? Explain that one, huh? You are exaclty right, we are talking about a vehicle that ins't buyable yet! I made my opinion about the weak engine in the H3 doesn't TO ME fit the name Hummer. Crap ppl, I was defending your own pride and joy vehicles by stating I didnt believe they deserved to be equiped with little engines. Yet you guys come and try and stomp on new person.
You make dramtic generaliztion about me being unwilling to listen to hummer owners. ABOUT WHAT???? Where do you see that, huh? Neither of you two obviously understand the points made and both of you backed MY points up when you try to refute me. Good job!!! Man ppl you need to settle down. I actually say I think Hummers should have more powerful engine(s), and throughout the thread, you guys say Hummer engines are weak, but you say they should have at least 60 more HP due to the weight. Well DUH!!!!!!! WTF you think I was saying the H3 needed a better engine for? Think about that! God ppl, we are in agreement, yet you can't see past the fact that you have 2000+ or more posts and I have less then 10. Whoopi!! Congrats on being an ass.

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PhilD:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kahloq:
The H1 is designed for pulling and climbing..period. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Since when? If you want something to pull with, you can get way better vehicles for substantially less money.

If you've driven a H1 or H2, you'll know that neither have outstanding performance, so it should not come as a great surprise that the H3 is no different.

Interestingly, the H3 with "only" 220hp offers an almost identical power to weight ratio as the H2.

I don't think the I-5 engine does an injustice to the Hummer name, after all, Hummers have historically been under powered.

Could the H3 have a more powerful engine, sure it could, as could the H2, but life is full of compromises. I would like to have seen the H2 offered with the 8.1 or a diesel, but I guess I'll just have to keep on wishing, as I doubt it will happen anytime soon.

The premise that the H3 is not in keeping with the Hummer name is simply false. In fact if it had a more powerful engine it would be out of keeping with the Hummer line. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ok look. First thing is I have driven the Military hmmwv(humvee), the civilian H1 and the H2. I can tell you, there is no other "suv" that can pull a full size artillery piece except a hmmwv(aka H1). What I have been trying to get at is what you also stated as well.....hummers are underpowered. What many of you have overlooked is the personage of hummer from those that DON'T own a hummer. Most ppl that don't and have never drivern one don't equate compromises with the name hummer. They think Hummer is the king of everything when it comes to an SUV. This is an implied point I have been trying to make, but I guess I should have spelled it out explicity. As far as power to weight ratio, yes they are lacking compared to many other suv brands. For example, the Jeep Grand Cherokee with the 5.7L hemi has 330 HP. Thats 5 more then the H2, however, the jeep vehicle is a lot less heavy. However, the public view of the hummer line is power, comfort, luxery to spare(civilain versions).
I think many of you that own hummers can't relate to that since you do own them and dont understand maybe why ppl think this. Its a lot to do with marketing BUT more so the simple fact that they are all linked back to the military(even tho the H2 has nothing to do with the military). BUT ppl equate Military with massive power(blow stuff up, the best of the best, etc mentality). It's just the way ppl think.

Since many of you have stated you think hummers are weak, you are making my case that the engines are not up to snuff of what ppl expect and that is the disappoitment! Those that havent owned a hummer before and then do the research to investigate and find that they are rather poor in performance get a little discouraged and that MAY account for the 25% drop in sales for the H2.
Once you understand the issue and my point from these perspectives, you should be able to see why I stated the engine was a disppointment for the H3. It's not for lack of MY personal experience with the hummer line, but rather the image the general public has about hummer being a power house vehicle.

[Kahloq]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sfox:
You are still missing the main point, most people don't understand, nor care about power to weight ratio. The reason for the 25% drop in sales is because GM oversold the first model year and the H2 is now selling like it should have in the first place. Blaming an underpowered engine is just silly, 99% of people that will buy one won't care or notice, they don't need the power of a bigger engine. As to pulling stuff, H1's are not a good tow vehicle...there is no debating this, a Dodge Cummins will out tow one anyday. This discussion has gotten stupid. We haven't said you were wrong about it being underpowered, that may well be (although having never driven one, who knows we may all be surprised), what we have said is that it IS typical of the brand and that most people looking to buy one won't care and it won't impact sales.

S <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, I'm not missing the point at all. Unfortunately, it's still you that is. You say that ppl looking to buy an H2 don't care about power. That's your opinion, but doesn't necessarily mean fact. Many ppl that buy H2s or look at them as an option are your typical soccor mom/dad ppl with no real offroad intentions at all. Then when they compare it(H2) to another vehicle and see the lower power to weight, they MAY think again. We could debate this fact over and over. Neither one of us can read ppl's minds, but for you to assume that the biggest reason H2's dropped in sales numbers is due to OVERSELLING by GM, that is pretty silly(your own word). No automaker is going to try and NOT sell as many vehicles as possible. Yes, many ppl bought them cuz they were new and now that they have been around a couple years, the newness has worn of to some degree and that does impact sales. But thats not the same thing as OVERSELLING LOL!
Anyhow....you also don't seem to understand that the original military hummer when it was introduced only had 150 HP. Now today, the H1 has 205. Not a big massive improvement, but some. The point tho, is that the military ones were still PULLING trailers that a dodge with a cummins deisel simply can't pull because of the total weight of the trailer. The Hummer is made to Pull things because of the frame its built from and the torque the engine has. The total HP isnt as important for the military version since its not really designed primarily for highway use and has no need to go 100MPH(which it can't), but can pull a 500 gallon water buffalo with ease.
More ppl care about power to weight issue then you think, especially those wanting to pull boats and such. And for those thinking about buying an H2 because of the eliteness factor, they will also consider a Cadillac Escalade(or EXT) and that vehicle has 345HP and weighs 900 pounds less. Obviously a much better power to weight ration then H2.
Maybe you didnt look at power to weight ratio when you bought your H2 or you didn't care, but that is you. A mojority of ppl would not think along your thought process in the real world outside of this forum. They would look at all a vehicle has to offer and its advantages and disadvantages to other vehicles. Anyone with the money to buy either isn't going to be a fool and just buy something in this price range with zero research. They are not dumb to begin with since they are in a position to have the money to buy this type of vehicle(unless they inherited money).

[Kahloq]

weight information just so you know:
cadillac escalade weighs 5571
cadillac escalade EXT weighs 5879
hummer H2 weighs 6400