Attn: gun experts

[Racer-X]

Ya, OK that all seems like a good plan.

[MarineHawk]

Can you say what state you live in?
do they not have a concealed carry law?
If not, what's the penalty for carrying concealed?
If felony (some states), think hard about it.
If misdemeanor, I'd be a little less worried.

On the gun, do you really want to put it in your front pocket? If so, you need something pretty small. These work very well and aren't terribly expensive: http://www.kel-tec.com/p3at.html
You don't need to worry about an external safety - just get a pocket holster.

If you're seriously thinking about confronting a gang, know what you're doing at all times; get very good with the gun on a combat range or just shooting cans in rapid succession outdoors - hitting them repeatedly as they stop moving; Think about what you'll do ahead of time when attacked/confronted; and get a more-powerful gun. The Kahr PM series that Co Hummer mentioned on the other thread is very good (though I would go with the .40 S&W personally). You might want to get the Glock 27 also. It only a little bigger, has a longer barrel (there's a pretty decent energy increase going from a 3.0 to a 3.5" barrel), and holds 10 rounds (9 + 1). IMO though, the Kahr and Glock work better from a holster than the pocket, but they have jmore knockdown power.

[RIC-H0]

[quote=MarineHawk]
On the gun, do you really want to put it in your front pocket? If so, you need something pretty small. These work very well and aren't terribly expensive: http://www.kel-tec.com/p3at.html
You don't need to worry about an external safety - just get a pocket holster.[quote]

I had a Kel-Tec in .380 and was uncomfortable to shoot. Granted, it is very small, but did not enjoy shooting it, and wouldn't place alot of confidence in a gun that cost less than $150!!!

Needless to say, I traded in that gun, I think for a case of ammo and a jerry can .

IMO

Ric

[MarineHawk]

Originally Posted by RIC-H0

I had a Kel-Tec in .380 and was uncomfortable to shoot. Granted, it is very small, but did not enjoy shooting it, and wouldn't place alot of confidence in a gun that cost less than $150!!!

Needless to say, I traded in that gun, I think for a case of ammo and a jerry can .
IMO
Ric

I wouldn't carry one somewhere when I was really expecting something to happen, because of the lack of firepower. However, I'm a lot more likely to have it with me and it's got enough firepower to do the job 98 times out of 100. I've shot about 500 rounds through mine without a single failure. They cost about $350 new - not $150 (you may have gotten a deal, but I've seen scores of them for sale in recent years and always between $340 and $390). My experiences have been pretty much the same as this guy: http://www.gunblast.com/KelTec_P3AT.htm
The advantage of the KT to me is that it's as powerful as a .38 Special but barely bigger than a set of keys. You can always have it with you. I wouldn't want to take on a gang with it, but that's because of the caliber - not the gun. It's not that I'm cheap - I own probably $20K in guns, but I can't findn a smaller, more reliable gun of decent power.

[RIC-H0]

Originally Posted by MarineHawk

I wouldn't carry one somewhere when I was really expecting something to happen, because of the lack of firepower. However, I'm a lot more likely to have it with me and it's got enough firepower to do the job 98 times out of 100. I've shot about 500 rounds through mine without a single failure. They cost about $350 new - not $150 (you may have gotten a deal, but I've seen scores of them for sale in recent years and always between $340 and $390). My experiences have been pretty much the same as this guy: http://www.gunblast.com/KelTec_P3AT.htm
The advantage of the KT to me is that it's as powerful as a .38 Special but barely bigger than a set of keys. You can always have it with you. I wouldn't want to take on a gang with it, but that's because of the caliber - not the gun. It's not that I'm cheap - I own probably $20K in guns, but I can't findn a smaller, more reliable gun of decent power.

Sorry, Didn't mean to dog your gun.
Just as previously mentioned, It's a personal preference!
and yeah, I did get a hell of a deal on it, but lost a little on the trade in, so I guess it was a wash!

[Lucifer]

I'd recommend the .500 S&W Ghetto Hunter. Make sure you get the sling option. I don't think you would have anymore problems with that thing slung around your shoulder.

[Mr. I - Man]

Bersa 45. cal is a nice mini pistol with some knock down power!
Bersa Thunder Ultra Compact/Mini Pistol

Manufacturing
Make: Bersa
aka: Firestorm, Eagle
Country: Argentina
MSRP: $425

Ballistics
Caliber: 9mm, .40 SW, .45 ACP
Capacity: 10/13 round mag
Action: DA/SA

Dimensions
Type: Compact Pistol
Weight: 27.51 oz (780g)
Length: 6.7" (170 mm)
Barrel: 3.6" (91 mm)

Design
Frame/Finishes:
Matte, Satin Nickel, Duotone, Gold
Safety:
Intergral Locking System, Maunual, Firing Pin, Decock
Sights:
fixed, with front sight integral to the s

Or H&K P13 if you want some very small that can 13 rounds down range!!

[MarineHawk]

Originally Posted by RIC-H0

Sorry, Didn't mean to dog your gun.

Yes you did. And I'm very hurt.
And now it's personal.
Not that I'm agreeing with you, but do I have to use that small plasticky POS when we have our invetitable duel at 20 paces?

[RIC-H0]

Originally Posted by MarineHawk

Not that I'm agreeing with you, but do I have to use that small plasticky POS when we have our invetitable duel at 20 paces?

Can we make it 10 paces...I'm not a very good shot!

[Arizona Hummerboy]

As a ex-police officer, I would say if you have to carry a gun, I would say take a hand gun training course on self defense. If you have to draw down on someone and point a gun at them, you must be ready and willing to shoot that person if you have to, and be willing to shoot to kill if it come's down to it.

[MarineHawk]

Originally Posted by Arizona Hummerboy

As a ex-police officer, I would say if you have to carry a gun, I would say take a hand gun training course on self defense. If you have to draw down on someone and point a gun at them, you must be ready and willing to shoot that person if you have to, and be willing to shoot to kill if it come's down to it.

Do you recommend the 12 gauge flame thrower rounds or the Macho Gaucho rounds for confronting inner-city gang members?

[RIC-H0]

Originally Posted by Arizona Hummerboy

As a ex-police officer, I would say if you have to carry a gun, I would say take a hand gun training course on self defense. If you have to draw down on someone and point a gun at them, you must be ready and willing to shoot that person if you have to, and be willing to shoot to kill if it come's down to it.

I completely agree...
Never point your gun at anything that you aren't willing to kill!
Education is the key to safety, and practice is mandatory!

[MarineHawk]

Originally Posted by Arizona Hummerboy

As a ex-police officer, I would say if you have to carry a gun, I would say take a hand gun training course on self defense. If you have to draw down on someone and point a gun at them, you must be ready and willing to shoot that person if you have to, and be willing to shoot to kill if it come's down to it.

BTW: I appreciate your service in the police force. It's just as valuable as military or other national service.

[ETD]

Are you an obvious target? I'm sure you do not drive in the Hummer, right? Are you going in at night with your signage and tattoo's ablazing? You have survived being held at gun point several times but having a gun in those situations would have guaranteed you getting killed, IMHO (unless you have a background in close quarter combat, NOT playing around @ the shooting range, but actually shooting at living/breathing people who want to kill you). IMHO, it is irresponsible for me and others to give you advice on what would be the best gun to have in your pocket when the coroner goes over your dead body. My own advice is if you consider those situations so intrinsic in your livelihood (for civilians, I can only come up with a couple of scenarios e.g. bounty hunter and body guard) then become proficient in close quarter combat by studying with a reputable professional rather than just shopping around for firearm (is your life really worth a one time purchase of $300-$500 or a lifetime of careful and diligent study of the martial arts). Most Ninjutsu practitioners, for example, are given wide berth in otherwise hostile territories based on just the aura they project. And that's just $0.02 worth of advice. Good luck.

[MarineHawk]

Originally Posted by ETD

IMHO, it is irresponsible for me and others to give you advice on what would be the best gun to have in your pocket when the coroner goes over your dead body.

IMHO, it is irresponsible for me and others to advise someone to not arm himself when the coroner goes over his dead body because he was in a fight without a weapon. Of course, he needs to be trained. Read the Armed Citizen feature in the American Rifleman. It's regulalry filled with stories of people who saved their lives by deploying a firearm against people who were threatening them annd/or their families. I've noticed that many of them are 80 year old women. certainly, most of them aren't Navy Seals or otherwise have a "background in close quarter combat."